Frances P. Arnold interview with Ophelia Bryant Smith

The John Burrison Georgia Folklore Archive recordings contains unedited versions of all interviews. Some material may contain descriptions of violence, offensive language, or negative stereotypes reflecting the culture or language of a particular period or place. There are instances of racist language and description, particularly in regards to African Americans. These items are presented as part of the historical record. This project is a repository for the stories, accounts, and memories of those who chose to share their experiences for educational purposes. The viewpoints expressed in this project do not necessarily represent the viewpoints of the Atlanta History Center or any of its officers, agents, employees, or volunteers. The Atlanta History Center makes no warranty as to the accuracy or completeness of any information contained in the interviews and expressly disclaims any liability therefore. If you believe you are the copyright holder of any of the content published in this collection and do not want it publicly available, please contact the Kenan Research Center at the Atlanta History Center at 404-814-4040 or reference@atlantahistorycenter.com. Ophelia B. Smith begins this interview by recalling her childhood growing up on a farm in Hall County, Georgia. She recollects how her mother made thread out of cotton, how her family harvested the apples from their 3,000-tree apple orchard, and how they made roof shingles from oak tree wood. Although she lived in a frame house, she describes her grandmothers two-story log cabin, which was built in 1842. She talks about homemade medicines, highlighting mustard plaster, a remedy that caused skin blistering but was believed to heal many illnesses. Next, Smith recalls gathering holly in the woods to decorate her house for Christmas, then lists some superstitions, including one that if a person washed their clothes on New Years Day, a family member would die before the year was over, as well as others about screech owls. After describing an old cure for warts, she talks about corn shuckings, an event where neighborhood women gathered to shuck corn, eat pie, and dance. She tells a story about her great-grandmother burying her husbands watch during the Civil War to hide it from the Union Soldiers, but a bird uncovered it and the soldiers found it anyway. Next, she tells a story about a man who would rather be buried alive than work and then traces its origin, noting its inaccuracies. She describes making soap from wood ashes and grease, explains smokehouses, and shares how her family would soothe a sore foot with a paste made of lye soap and cornmeal. Ophelia Bryant Smith (1894-1974) lived in Murrayville, Georgia, with her husband, Thad Smith, and her daughter, Dorothy Parker. She died in Decatur, Georgia. No additional biographical information has been determined. ---- ----------------- C- Collector I- Informant CH- Collector's Husband C- Mrs. Smith, I sure do appreciate your letting me come over to see you. It was good when we used to live nextLdoor to each other and you used to tell me ,about how you lived in the country when you ere a girl. Where did you grow up? I-In, uh, Hall county, 12 miles from Gain\ville. )\ C-Well, good. You had a big family, I guess? I-Eleven in the family and I was the oldest of seven girls. C- You had brothers/though. I-Yeah-4 brothers ana 1egirls. C- Well,You were telling me what all you alldid on the farm, how you made things-and had your hogs & cows. Tell me about it. I- We made sausage- we made pressed meat-First we growed the hO.gs- fatten~~ the hogs- we made all of our meat-and-uh- my mother, she'~it; made the thread, spun the thread and knit- C. Did you grow your cotton to make the thread? I- Growed the cotton and a lota times we'd pick the seed out of the cotton and she would card the cotton into thread. We'd pick the seed out, wouldn't take it to the gin, we'd have a littleJyou know. We'd dust set around and pick the seed out and then she'd card it with cards and knit the thread and the mountaineers, they'd come down with a load of wool in sacks and-,-uh,she'd buy the wool. CY Well, now, y~all--- was this in the mountains that you 11ved? I- No- I was about twelve miles from the mountains. C- YeaR-but you had apple orchards you told me. I- Oh, yes. Wad a big apple orchard,about 3000 trees. C. Well, now, was this the way your daddy made his living? L- Yeah. C- With the apples? I- Yeah. Well, we growedd our food, you see, but now the surplus money we had was made from apples, selling apples. I think about $8.00 a barrel. c- How many acres did you have? 1- Well, I don't know how many acres; they's 3000 trees. I don't know how many acresc- Did the children all do the harvesting? Or did you have "hands" 1- We had help. C- Negroes? i Ie" for Wi I 1- No. White peoplet'I'dont think ever did a nigger work there. We made theltormula) to spray the trees out of sulphur and arsenic and lime- made it up- we'd make about two or three hundred gallons- you'd take one gallon of this solution that was made up and pour it in 60 gallons of water. C- Well now did your daddy think up this solution or did he read it somewhere? I. Oh , thair was a man -that come thair from-uh- what is this valley up 1m Virginia where they grow so many apples? C- Shenandoah. 1- Yeah, Shenandore Valley. He c~e thair and stayed a week and then he sent a formiler thart and we boiled it. You had to boil it in a pot. C- Black iron pot? 1- Yeah. C- In the yard 1- You could smell it a mile~~ (laughter) C- I'll bet you could~l (laughter) 1- Yeah~ (laughter) You see you'd put one gallon of that to 60 ~~l~on of water and then you that this sprayer that '~~~la put this barrel on the waon and this long handle on this sprayer-it ud be just a fog co~e from that on the trees and the trees'us sprayed in the spring when they'us in bloom- while the'wuz a Ii ttle petal on em. and then when the J ! Jl] petal fell we'd spray'em again and thst'us tfue end of the work for the apples. (~ause) The next thing we done in the apple orchard was pick up the apples and pick apples, C- And you had mules and wagons? Did you use sleds or wagons? 1- Oh, wagons~ c- And then what all did you grow on your farm? You said you grew everything. 1- Well/we had wheat and corn, sweet potatoes, arsh (irish) potatoes, ~abbase and we growed some colliflour (cauliflower) c- Oh, you did? 1- Yeah, and uh, colliflour, (celery). (pause)You know we wineer. and uh- we've gr~wed some celryy banked our cab~e up in the -'f c- Oh yeah, and it kept all winter? I Yeah, Well, listen, you'd open a furr'r (furrow),a deep furr'r in the ground,and you'd pull your cab~e up and set ~ 'em along this furr'r and then you'd cover em up with pine bark er pine tops and then throw dirt on ~ep of that and you'd go back ther any time in the winter and get cabbage. O~ th~d be just as white as they could be~ C- And you had your potatoes in your potato hills? 1- Had potatoes-rutabaggus,- we growed rutabaggers- well, I don't think there was any thing much we didn't -C- Well, now you said your mother had her spinning wheel, I meaM- spun her cotton and all- mean 1- Oh, yes. c- She had a big spinning wheel? I-She had a ~ spinning wheel and she had cards, and then she had a thing, a reel, I think it was- after she'd git the thread off this thing that was on the spinning wheel, after she'd tWist it, she'd put it on this reel. c- Uh huh- 1- And that'ud make it into hanks. And then she'd roll it into balls when she'd start kni ttin. c~ Oh Yeah? Well, now, what else did you do? You had cows of course- that you milked and your hogs that you butchered? L- Oh1yeah. c- Did you butcher anytime? ---that it was cold, I guess? 1- Cold weather 6~tBut how 'bout butchering cows. Dit it matter when you butchered them? 1- Well, we never did kill an{y cows. C- Oh, you didn't? Just had 'em for the milk? C. Yeah, Well, you were telling me the other day that yell made shingles for ~pur house. I- Oh, yeah! Well you've saw them made, haven't you? I CH-Yes, uh huh. (husband of collector speaks uplAnd what was it you ~sed to make 'em with? I- Froe, you know what froe is? Froe is a thing they put down on the timeer and cut it-to cut the board. Now.boards are made different to shangles, shangles is made on a machine, like a saw-uh-like a saw mill- shangle mill, they call 'em. Well these here boards are made outa oak and they cut these big trees,sout so large around (she holds up hands to demonstrate size of tree trunk 18" or more in diameter) and they cut'em about that long-they'd cut em up in blocks,'bout J or4 feet and then- they'd quarter em up and then they'd take this froe, which was a long~hard piece of arn (iron) and they'd hit it with a maIler and start splittin' boards out. C- Some sort of ma~l? I- Yeah they had a maul, they'd hit this froe with. You never did see'em make boards? CH- No, I never did one of those. I- Well, they's houses up there now that's got boards on em. They last fer they're mad~out of oak. C- Well, now,what kind of houses did y'all have? Frame houses? I- Oh yeah, we had a frame. C. Were your outbuildings made our of logs or st~e? I- Made-uh, out of frame. But, you know, my grandmother's house is made out of logs 'bout this big around (holds up hands in circle about 8" orlO" in diameter) and hewed down and put~tgether with a great big wooden spike. Its still standing. C- You don~ usually find lem put to~ther with spikes. You just usuallJ f~nd 'em notched/don't you? 1- Well, they notched 'em and then they put this big-a-wooden --- kind of a --- I don't know what you'd call it-its pagged (p~ged~, wooden pags that 'udd go down in that notch Why, that house is still standin'. Cy How many rooms? I- Oh, they's, I think, they's only 4 rooms standing of it. c- One story? I- No, its two story. C. You don't usually find log houses made two story. I- Well, listen, this is a two story- they's two/rooms upstairs and two downsta'rs that's still standint and the man is usin' it for a barn. See, he ~ puts his feed in the barn. The house's built in 18 and 42. c. Did it have one front door or two? You remember? I- One c. Was it a dog trot house with a hall in the middle? I- No, it was'nt. My grandmother, she They had a big farm. They had several ~nants on their farm. C. Now, your mother and daddy and all grew up ~n that section of the country? I- Why, they's ra1ksedd. right up' together-rat ther- they went to the same church-we all went to the same church. Lve~'W~~~ C. What church? I- Yeller Creek Baptist. C- You all didn't sing the So-Fa-La songs, did you? :'{\11lV" I- NO,but they's people~that did- C- Sacred Harp singin~- I- Did you see em the other Sunday on television? C- Sure didl You were telling me about some of your medicines that you all made ~d used. c. Did you use the plants-or the seeds- or what? I- You'd use the see~s. You'd take a rolling p1m or a bottle. You mash them seed out- you had 'em on a cloth- and you mash 'em out and then you put a little flour in it-- and let's seewhat else did they put-- they put flour and water, and you'd I- Oh, God (aside) laughter. that plaster? Well, first of if anybody got sick they had away (laughter) I -Oh, that's pit,ful-Tell about all they growed the mustard, and a mustard plaster made right J put that mustard plaster on 1~u and hit;ud blister you in a few minutes. C- Did you use a cloth? 1_ Ywah. Ma~a poultice. Didn't you never make a mustard plaster? I CH- Tell her what its like. I've had them. C- Well, tell about your brother/though/that--- 1- Well, listen he had heart trouble and my mother made a mustard plaster. Held take spells of smotherin' and you know, my mother'd make a mustard plaster and she'd blister his chest-blister it, now- let it blister right over hishear~ and the blister come up thdr and sheld take a needle- sterilize a needle- and pick that blister and the water'd just pour out uv it and then- she'd take cabbage leaves and mash and bruise them and put a poultice on thur to keep it from burning. C- That poor guy-(laughter) CH- What was the point? To get the water out? I-To get the water away from his heart. Well- he'd always get better. CH- Well it worked then. 1- Yes, it did-(laillghter)-if you could stand1t. CH- Of all thingst 1- Well, listen, Now, when my hmsband's ali~in' I made ~ mustard plaster! You know he'd ha~e an awful c8ugh- he had an awful cough-and he'd cough, you know- and uh~ I'd just go in and I'd take me about ( uh-they used tooIilllllfch mustard-) about uh table splflon full of mustard and put the rest of it-uh- what is this stuff- mh flax seed-flax seedd meal- and then, put you about a tablespoon uv mustard in it and put it on there and let it stay about three minutes 'till it turns pink and take it off[now that's a proper way~Now thatlll hep you, all right. Cw Well)what other kinds ~f medicines did you use? Did you all ever have to take sulphur and molasses? 1- Yeah we tuk that and I'll tell you all the medicine we ever taken was castor oil. CH- Castor oi11 1- Yeah. C- But that wasn't a home-made remedy. Tell me about some of the other home remedies. I- well) let me see now CH- How about sassyfras? I- Well they drank that for tea and for spice tea. Did you ever see it spice? . C. But that was just for a drink not for a medicine, was it? I- No- but they claimed that's good for ya. Well, did you ever see any spice agrowin? CH- No, I- It has a 11 ttle yeller bloom on it in the sprang. It smells just like this spice you buy. c. Well, sure, that's the way they grow it, you know- I- Well/they had plenty of that and we'! have spice tea and we'd have sassafras tea C. Well,beside the food that you grew and had, what else did ~u make on the farm clothes? You didn't make your shoes, did your meat that besides your you? you I- Oh, nol We growed peanuts and popcorn. We had plenty of that. C- Well, now, at Christmas time what did you all do? Anything special? Iy Yeah, we went down in the woods and gathered a load of holly and it covered iln red berries as red as that sweater (reference to collectors red sweater) and decorate the house. c. Did you all celebrate the 25th of December or did you celebrate old Christmas in January? I I- Oh- the 25th of December. CH- Did you ever string popcorn? I- Yeah, we'd string that a~d put it on the Christmas tree. Did you ever see that? And, well- you know, when Christmas c come- we started celebratin~t at Christmas Eve and we didn't do anything 'til after New YliiE.:.' No work- atall1 We celebrated and we'd visit all the kids in the neighborhood C. Did you get any presents? I- Oh, Yeah. ./ C- Bought presents or did you make 'em? I-No. My daddy, he'd buy us something. He'd buy us dolls and He'd buy the boys guns, -little guns-play guns- and knives. C- Did you have any belief about bad luck, that if you started a garment on a certain day ~ou couldn't finish it ? I- Well, now, if you wash your clothes on New Yur somecayour family'll die before the yans over. Did yur ever hur that? C- I~e heard that. Well, what were you telling me about a screeipl owl? I- Ther'a so many about a scrOOCH owl--- I couldn't--- C- No but you said you heard one in your back yard the other day. What would you all do if you heard a screech owl? I- We'd say, "flomebody's gonna die". C. Well, what would you do to keep from having bad luck? I- Well, let~ see now- what was it---? Oh, go and stick the poker in the fireplace. Did you ever hear that? Or you can tie a knot in a sheep. Or go and take a pare of ya shoes to the back door ar the ~ont door and turn 'emuu~ C- My mother used to tell me about that. We'd turn our shoes upside down on the door sill. I- Well, we've done that- or tie a knot in a corner of a sheet. C- What else brou~ht bad luck? I- I don't know--- I can't think of any moreCH- Did you ever hear any cure for warts? ~ I-~Yeah- you cut the wart- make it blee~. and put a dr~p uv blood in a grain of corn and give it to the chicken. CH- We did thatt We did it in Alabama. C. Well did the corn have to be special- any color. I heard it had to be white corn. I- No-uh uhl C- Did they go away?(laughter) I I- Well, its been so long--- but I did have one on this finger and it went away---but I didn't feed any corn to a chicken. Well they d4rfe a lot of funny things up in thur. (pause) We had corn shuckins-shuckins-and dances- after t~e shuckins. The women 'ud go-ever woman in the neighborhood would go in the mornin' to this house where we's havin' the corn shuckin's=maybe 7 or 8 of 'em. They'd kill four or five hens, they'd have a ham o'meat- maybe two hams- they'd bake ever' kind of pie you could think uv and chicken pies this big aroundlher arms circled an imaginary, very large pie) in pansdeep pies, and punkin pb~, pertater pie,peach pies, peach cobblers, apple cobblers- Thur'd be 50 or 60 people, you know, ~here to feed. Then after the corn wus shucked-why, they'd have a dance. C- Where would they have the dance? I- At the house. In the big house. Ch- Wasn't there a prize in the corn sbhaking? That if you found a yellew ear of corn? I- Oh, yeah, IVe h,ared that, too. C- What king~ of music did you have? I- Oh, somebody'd playa violin---er a banja! C- You called it a fiddle then, didn-t you? I- Yeah. C- Did you all sing?or just danced I- Danced. C- What kind of dancin? I- Squar dancin' That's all the dancin---well, thar was a lot of people that could waltz. e- Did any of them think it was wrong to dance? I- Lordl (aside) (laughter) listenl One time we went to our uncle's house an~ thur neighbor's givin a dance up ther. Its Christmas time. Well, us three girls all went- and my daddy, he !!neared it. He says, II Yeah 1 Heared about you goin to the dance. They're goin turn you outa the chruch over hur when Conference meets'~ Well (laughter) we said we didn't care if they did. But thur never ~uz nothin sed about it. But, Oh yeah, they used to threatin that. The~'d threaten to turn people out of the church fer dancin~ C- But the~idn't I- No. They didn't want you to, though. c- Well, now, you were telling about your grandaddy's watch bein buried during the war. I" 1- That was my great grandaddy. I\s buried out by the ash hopper. Now the ash-hopper's wh~re they put the ashes to make soap. And the Yankees were comin and g~anmais she buried the gold watch of grandpa's out by the ash-hopper and the hen was out thur scratchin' and acratched it out. (laughter) And the Yankee got it-(laughter) She said they went in the house. They took ever wool blakke~ they'd made on a loom (my grandmother had a loom) they took ever wool blanke~ she'd made and they asked her if she had anything to eat, "well, yes" she said, "I've got something to eat. I've got a basket af eggs in the basement-cellar it was- they called it- they didn't have no basement, and he says, "If you'll cook these eggs for us we won't gouch anything in your house". That's the other grammanot this gramma I's tellin'about. So Granma, she boiled them wggs fur 'e~nd they taken 'em out and eat 'em and the next mornin' theY. went to a neighbor'S house and they got sacks of corn and broug?t to the orchard- the woods- there near my my grandmothers and ~d thur horses and they got up on the horses in the middle of the day to leave thun and one of the s1~iers fell off one of the horses and broke his neck and one sez, "Well, I'll never tell what went with him"and they buriedAup thur in the woods. hiM CH- Is that right? C- Tell me how ya~ll ma&esoap 1- Oh well, you had to have green wood- you had to have them ashes from green wood- and you'd put em indthis hopper- and you's start pourin' water- make a little~p!ace in there where it Iud hold water- and you'd--when it got to drippin- see that 'ud be lye. And then you'd take any old grease you had around the house- you'd take that-and put it with this lye- and put it in a pot and boil it- for maybe a hour or two and it 'ud thicken--- and ther's yev soap. C- Did y'all use the name pot for making your soap and cookin your'bracklin's? 1- Oh, no, we had separate pots. C- You were telling me the other day about this fella your brother said was so lazy. Did you know his name? 1- Newt Andersont C- Tell Ernest about tlim. 1- This feller he wuz too lazy to work- they said he's too~lazyand he said he'd just rather die than to work. They said, \l Well, we'll jus t take you to the cemetary and bury you" ~ td"lO: he said, "All right". So they put him in a wagon and started down the road with 'em. And they sez, "He~ho've you got there?m Well, sez, "Newt Anderson. Sez he sez hef~.- ~o lazy he don't wanta live- Sez he'd rather die than work". So he sez, "Oh, don't take im and bury him alive. Sez- I'll give him a bushel 0' corn". Well, Newt raised up and he sez, "Is it shelled?" (hearty laughter ,frmm C. &CH about I's fmnny story) C- That's real goodL Did he live aroung there? I- Yeah, he lived in the community. C. Was he lazy or did they just make up the story on him? I- Well he wuzn't that lazy/(laughter) I C- Was he a character---? I- Well, he'd take 'em good- He'd never get mad. C, 1fut I mean he wasn't a kind of "dumb" person? I- Oh, no, he was just a good-natured feller. He didn't never get mad at $aything. CH- Lemme ask ya. Did you ever have a smokehouse? I- Oh, jlesL CH- Well, tell Frances how it works. I tried to tell her the other day. I- Well, after you kill the meat you !ang it up in the smokehouse. They's rafters that have logs across there and they take and they hang it up and then they take chlpshickry chips is what they used= and they'd just keep a fire 3 smotherin' there fer about a week. C- Where'd you build the fire? I- On the ground. The smoke house didn't have a floor- it 'us just a dirt floor. And there's no chiminey. You'd just take chips and just burn it and smoke the meat brown.It 'ud smoke it real nice. C- Wouldn't it just smoulder along? I- Yeah, you kept it smoulderin 'all the time. C- Then you used that smoked meat all winter? I- Oh, yeah- Cy Did you use more smoked meat or more salt pork? I- Well, you didn't smoke your sals poek. You'd smoke your hams and shoulders and what ~ you cut off the midddin'say you'd cmt off a part ther for bacon- like we havebacon we buy C- Now wh~t all diq you make from the hog? c- Sausage: And you stuffed it back in the casings.? I- No, uh uh- we put 'tin shucks. C & CH- Shucksl You did! I- Yeah, did you ever see it put in shucks? Well/you take and you sauck a ear 0 'corn and pull the shucks back and break the corn off and leave them pretty white shucks next and then you fill that QP and tie it ~p and hang it up and dry it. C- Would it be air dried? I- Yeah you just hang it up in the smokehouse. You hang it up with the rest 6f it. C- Very good- never heard of that. I- Well, I bet your mother has. C- You used every part of the hog. I- Ever;jl;thing but the "squealer"! (laughter) C- Everything but the "squealer"! (laughter) Tails and earSi<. too? I- Yeah, used that to make press meat. C- I heard that if the tail was turned the wrong way you couldn't use it-it was bad luck ._-J1e.o..ret.- I .. Oh, (laughter) now I never (hear<\! that one'! C- And you used the head and ears and everything. I- Ueed everything. CH- Used that to make souse meat. C- And you made liver cheese-Well this has certaintly been interesting. CH- Well, I wanted to ask what you did - if you stuck a nail in your foot- to get the soreness out? Tell you what we did. We put iat meat on it- and it pulled the soreness out. C-What did you do- tie a bandage on it? CH- Put the fat meat against where you's stuck a nail in your foot and tie a rag around it. Or risin's or something like that. I- Well I've seen that done- but I'll tell you somethin' better than taat- is to take some lye soap and make up a paste out of corn meal and lye soap. C- Wouldn't it burn? I- No, sirt It<bn't' I've tried that. CH- Well what is this--- ~ou said something about biscuit. I- Yeah, well- that's for risin's. Just take a biscuit an~ cut it in two and dip part of it in sweet milk and make a poultice and poultice the abcess ap with it. You've saw where they wouldn't come to a head? Well, that's what they do. That's good remedy. It'sEJ. right. Cy Did you all take any internal1 medicine that you all made up there on the farm- or just (laughter) caxtor oml~ I- Yeah. Seena (senna). C- What's that? I~ Its a purgative. Grows- it looks like-like English peas when it's growin- only its' bunch. They had senns- made senna tea- that's for a purgative. Yf you can drink it your'e a good one~ (laughter). ffiut they've got that in the drug store now. Cat-nip- they had that for babies- they'd make a tea out of it when the baby had a stomach ache. Well now I tell you I heared one they said a man done up there- I didn't see him do this- but I heared it- his baby kad the bell~ache one time and they'd doctored and doctored it- and he goes out and b~ys him terbac~er-chewin' terbacker-(tobacco) and ~hey said he chewed terbacker and spit terbacker juice on that baby's "belly 'till the pore little thing vomited. C- Did it get better? (laughter) I- (laughter) Yeah- ain't that awful~ They told it on him. They said he done it. C- Well, Mrs. Smith, I want to thank you for telling me all of this. And mow, tell me your name and let me get it down on !Illl! paper. I- Ophelia B. Smith. You want my maid name? OpheliaaBryant Smith. Cy And what was your address, now? I- Murrayvi~le (Murryv~lle) c- And you said it was how far from Gainsville? I- Twelve miles north. C- I bet you wouldn't tell me whene you were born, would you? I- Yes, I will-l894 c- And you~e proud of itl 1- Yeah. c- Good for youl Well, I surely thank you ma'aml A PDF transcript exists for this recording. Please contact an archivist for access. Professor John Burrison founded the Atlanta Folklore Archive Project in 1967 at Georgia State University. He trained undergraduates and graduate students enrolled in his folklore curriculum to conduct oral history interviews. Students interviewed men, women, and children of various demographics in Georgia and across the southeast on crafts, storytelling, music, religion, rural life, and traditions. As archivists, we acknowledge our role as stewards of information, which places us inaposition to choose how individuals and organizations are represented and described in our archives. We are not neutral, andbias isreflected in our descriptions, whichmay not convey the racist or offensive aspects of collection materialsaccurately.Archivists make mistakes and might use poor judgment.We often re-use language used by the former owners and creators, which provides context but also includes bias and prejudices of the time it was created.Additionally,our work to use reparative languagewhereLibrary of Congress subject termsareinaccurate and obsolete isongoing. Kenan Research Center welcomes feedback and questions regarding our archival descriptions. If you encounter harmful, offensive, or insensitive terminology or description please let us know by emailingreference@atlantahistorycenter.com. Your comments are essential to our work to create inclusive and thoughtful description.