Radine Bergen interview with Wayne Harrell, Shelby Jean Harrell, Bud Moore, and Jean Moore (part two)

The John Burrison Georgia Folklore Archive recordings contains unedited versions of all interviews. Some material may contain descriptions of violence, offensive language, or negative stereotypes reflecting the culture or language of a particular period or place. There are instances of racist language and description, particularly in regards to African Americans. These items are presented as part of the historical record. This project is a repository for the stories, accounts, and memories of those who chose to share their experiences for educational purposes. The viewpoints expressed in this project do not necessarily represent the viewpoints of the Atlanta History Center or any of its officers, agents, employees, or volunteers. The Atlanta History Center makes no warranty as to the accuracy or completeness of any information contained in the interviews and expressly disclaims any liability therefore. If you believe you are the copyright holder of any of the content published in this collection and do not want it publicly available, please contact the Kenan Research Center at the Atlanta History Center at 404-814-4040 or reference@atlantahistorycenter.com. This is part two of a two part recording in which the interviewees recall various superstitions. The recording begins with Jean and Bud Moore describing the belief that if a person washes their clothes in between Christmas and New Years, a member of their family will die before the new year. Wayne and Shelby Harrell then describe another involving dirty dish rags and how they can treat warts. At 01:55 the group debates various superstitions involving road crossings and their relation to stys. At 03:36 the interviewees switch to the topic of traditional medicine, and Shelby explains how blowing smoke in ones ear, or preparing a hot water bottle by heating salt, can help soothe earaches. Jean adds that pouring the blood of an unnamed insect into the ear can also serve as a remedy for earaches. The end of the recording is fuzzy, additional superstitions are written in the transcript. Shelby Harrell (1939-2019) was born in Kingsport, Tennessee, to Goldie and Howard Brooks. She graduated from Hiwassee College. In 1958, she married Wayne Harrell and they had one daughter, Kimberly H. Littrell, after which the family moved to Atlanta, Georgia. Linda Jean Birchfield (1932-2016) was born in Surgoinsville, Tennessee, to Ralph and Marylou Birchfield. She grew up in East Tennessee where she married Bud Moore in 1956. In 1965 the Moores moved to Decatur, Georgia, where they raised three children. Bud Moore worked in public relations for nearly 20 years for a McDonald's Franchisee in metro Atlanta. They later moved to Snellville, Georgia. Family history COLLECTING PROJECT FOR FOLKLORE 307 My first Informant was my neighbor, Shelby Harrell (about 27 years old) who moved to Decatur, Ga. from Kingsport, Tenn. about two and a half years ago. Her husband, Wayne, is a printer and worked for the Kingsport Press. By the time the strike at The Press had lasted a couple of years, they and a number of other families had moved to the Atlanta area to work. We had talked a number of times in the last two years about beliefs and expressions used by our parents and grandparents, so one afternoon about three weeks ago we started writing down things she could remember from Kingsport to see if there would be enough for me to use. This first part is what she dictated to me that afternoon plus things she and Wayne told me in the next few days. In general, these are things they remember but don't believe themselves. Their grandparents and some of their relatives believe them and to some other relatives, they are stories you tell to children. Wayne uses many of the expressions; Shelby not so many, except when she's being funny CURES ASTHMA: You have to get a branch a sourwood tree. A non-member of the family has to measure the child and cut the limb to the length. Then you have to cut a lock of the child's hair and take it to a tree in a strange woods (not just back of your house). You measure up on a tree with the sourwood branch and make a slit; and put in the hair. Then you stick the limb in your attic or loft (somewhere where it won't get wet. It won't work if it gets wet.) and when the child out grows the limb she out grows the asthma. Shelby learned this from her grand- father who was from Southwestern Virginia. Wayne and Shelby have an asthmatic child who has been so sick at times that they have been willing to try almost anything and her grandmother kept after them until they tried this. When it didn't work she insisted they must have used the wrong stick or had a relative do it and they should try again as it always works. They didn't. Other cures for asthma: Sleep on a pillow of pine straw. (neighbor's housekeeper from South Carolina.) Burn a teaspoon of whiskey Mix honey and whiskey. Take a teaspoon of turpentine. (Shelby's sister-in-law's mother from Virginia, They didn't try this one.) Wear a chamois against your chest. (This is also used for bronchitis. BOILSTake the lining of an egg shell and put it over the boil. Leave it 'til it dries and pull it off. (This is from a man who lived next door in Kingsport. I tworked the one time Shelby tried it.) WARTS: The counter (The person in the community who knows how to take off warts ) counts each wart and gets a pebble for each wart. Pt them in a bag and tie it up and take it to a fork of the road and throw it North so no one can find it. (Shelby's grandmother) Rub the wart with a dirty dishrag (He later remembered the dishrag has to be stolen.) and bury the rag under the rain barrel or the leak of the house (where water runs off the roof if there's no gutter). (Wayne--from his grandmother.) STY: Don't say anything about it. If someone says, "You have a sty", you say, "It's a lie! It's a lie! It's a lie!" and it will go away. (Shelby, from her grandmother. ) Say, "Sty , sty on my eye, go to the next person that passes by. (Wayne ) BEE STING: Wrap it in apple butter. (Shelby, from her aunt.) Put wet tobacco on a bee sting. Also on snake bite. (Wayne) SNAKE BITE: Put mud on a snake bite. EARACHE: Blow smoke in the ear. (Shelby's father used this on her when she was a child.) COUGH: Take kerosene and molasses. TOOTHACHE: Put a heated clove on the tooth. CUTS: Use alum. or Lat a dog lick a wound. NOSEBLEED: Put scissors or a knife down the back of your neck. (Shelby's mother does this.) Put a dime under your upper lip. (Wayne knew a boy who carried a dime there all the time because he always had noeebleedd. ) FRECKLES: Wash your face in stump water PROVERBS It's an ill wind that won't blow two ways. (If someone does a favor or pays a visit, you should return the favor or visit. Shelby's mother says this quite often.) A bird in hand is worth two in the bush. A chain is as strong as its weakest link. Pretty is as pretty does. You reap what you sow. The more you stir in shit , the worse it stinks. (Said by just about everyone, Including Wayne's mother, who wouldnt think of swearing or telling a dirty joke.) BELIEFS If you see a falling star, a member of your family will die. If you dream you're falling off a cliff and you don't wake up before you hit the bottom, you'll die. If a writing spider counts your teeth and writes it out, you'll die. (All my informants can remember believing this as children and trying to keep their mouths shut.) If you tell a white lie, white spots come under your fingernails. If it rains while sun shines, it means Jesus is crying. Thunder is a sign Gods angry. (These are told to children.) Never eat in the toilet. You're feeding the devil. It's bad luck to step on a grave. Or take flowers from a grave. Don't eat a persimmon 'til the first frost. (It 'll pucker your mouth. ) Don't get cut during "dog days" --it won't heal. If a baby licks out" his tongue, it means hig mother didn't gat something she wanted to eat (during pregnancy). He'll quit when he gets that food. If a baby has a birthmark, the same reason is often given. The following are beliefs Wayne learned from friends and farmers he hunted with. It's bad luck to shoot a dove, (When marking a trail or land) Mark a tree on the North side. The bark is thicker so it won't kill the tree. If you're hunting or hiking and you smell a cucumber, it's a sign there's a copperhead To tell If water's pure, put in a salamander, frog, or crawdad. If it dies, it's not pure. To get away from a hoopsnake (blue racer) turn a corner. The boar squirrel "clips the balls" of all male babies in the nest but one so he will be head of the den. (This is believed by the man he hunts with but he said he recently learned tn biology it just appears that way as the testicles recede In the squirral/s body until rutting season.) If you kill a poison snake, hang It on a tree or fence and it keeps other snakes away. If a cow goes dry it's because it's been milked by a milk snake. (A King snake) If you kill a quail, never hold it while it's dying because if it quivers it will make you nervous. A winter with little snow is a sign of poor crops in the spring. (Snow feeds the ground.) A snake feeder is a sign of a snake nearby (in the water). RIDDLES from Wayne via Shelby What's the most complete thing in the world? A rooster because it has a pecker on both ends. What's the most conceited thing in the world? A flea floatin' down the river yellin, Raise drawbridge! What's the meanest thing in the world? A whompus cat . What's a whompus cat? A cat with a head on both ends. How does he shit? Thats what makes him so mean. CHILDREN'S RHYMES a song Shelby's grandmother sings to Shelby's daughter. Jaybird, Jaybird , Sittin' on a limb. He winked at me And I winked at him. If my old rifle Had a' been true, I'd a shot that Jaybird Through and through These are the verses you sing when your mother cant hear: Jaybird, Jaybird , Sittin' In the grass. Draw back, draw back, Shoot 'im in the ass. Jaybird, Jaybird , Sit tint in a cedar. Draw back, draw back, Shoot im in the peter. And another from Wayne: Listen, listen, I hear a cat pissin. Run, run, get the gun. Ah huh, he's done! WORDS AND PHRASES slowern Ned in the First Reader dumbern Ned meaner than a striped snake bold as brass onry as a polecat alike as two peas in a pod crazy as a bed bug skinny as a rail silly as a goose stout as a mule higher than a cats back quicker than greased lightning strong as an ox shorter thana stump fat as a pig sharp as a tack and sharp as a tack and twice as flat-headed madder than a wet hen uglier than homemade sin ugly as a mud fence purty as a speckled pup poorer than Jobs turkey slower than smoke off a shit tired as a one legged man at an ass kickin tightern Dicks hat band (means someone is stingy. It can mean something fits tightly.) smartern a Philadelphia lawyer lower than a moles ass and its underground (example--used when holding a bad poker hand) slicker than owl shit (example--when theres sleet on the roads) coldern a witchs tit Th old ladys pickin her geese. and Its spittin snow. both mean slow flurries. rainin like a cow peein on a flat rock gullywasher is a heavy rain storm Its too hot to eat meat! book learnin means education educated fool means one with learnin but no common sense to Strut like a Tom is to be proud Hed steal the pennies off a dead mans eyes. Shes four ax handles broad. Ill get on you like a duck on a June bug. Havent seen you in a month a Sundays Haint seen ya in a coons age. Looked all over Hell and half a Georgia. (when you cant find something) shiverin like a dog passin peach seeds playin possum is being coy, tricky, or deceiving. Youre pullin my leg. mad as a hornet mad enough to bite a ten penny nail in two two hoots an a holler and a little ways up the road mean a short distance. If someones pleased about something, he could grin a possum down. cottonmouth is when your mouth feels dry, fuzzy. If you shiver, you say, Someone stepped on my grave. If you see something really great--a sight youve never seen before, its like the devil ridin a rail! (example-- When Waynes family drove up in a car for the first time, his grandmother said, You look like the devil ridin a rail!) If someone starts to leave and you want them to stay, you say, Stick around. Well open a keg a nails n peel a punkin. If youre going out with no set destination, youre just traipsin around. If youre not doing anything, youre just hobobbin around, lolly gaggin, pee-dickerin around, fiddlin around, or piddlin around. Shelbys grandmother thinks a visit should last all day. If someone doesnt stay long, she says, They just go in n out the window. Theyll throw you so far under the jail, theyll have to shoot a bowl a beans to ya with a shotgun. (Warning, when someone is doing anything he shouldnt) If you have good luck, youve been payin the preacher. Thatd worry a preacher to death. or Thats enough to make a preacher cuss. aint worth a hill a beans or wont amount to a hill a beans You aint got sense God give a goose. or You aint got sense enough to come in out of the rain. My other informants are Bud and Jean Moore (both are about 35), who moved here from Kingsport at about the same time and for the same reasons as the Harrells. Bud is from Kingsport Jean is originally from Hawkins County, Tenn. which seems to be considered the back of the backwoods by everyone else in East Tennessee. Jean's mother died when she was very young and Jean was raised by her grandmother. They lived on the side of a mountain between Surgoinsville and Rogersville. Jean was about 15 before they had electricity. Her grandmother believed In ghosts and witches and used to tell them stories at night until they were so scared they couldn't move--but Jean cant remember the stories. Jean said she also used to sing at ol sad had so many verses she could sing it all night" . This turned out to be Barbry Allen. But Jean doesn't sing herself. Everyone around there called her grandmother Mammy Birchf i eld and went to her because she knew about witches and how to remove curses. And people came from miles around to her aunt who could blow the fire out of burns. They were the only ones for miles who had a radio so everyone gathered there to hear The Grand Ol Opry. Jean remembers pouring water on the ground post to cool it and keep the radio working so they could get the Opry. Jean was willing to tell me all the things she could remember but she didn't want to be recorded. She Is sensitive about the way she talks and the things she believes because shes been teased about being a hillbilly so much by her neighbors. And she had been sick so I didn't think I 'd be able to record But one Saturday (Nov. 5) she said Shelby and I could come over In the evening to write down some things. I spent the day trying to rent or borrow a recorder, just in case. Late in the afternoon, I met a neighbor whose child has a transistor model, made in Japan. The quality of the recording is not too good but it was that or nothing. About an hour before we were to leave, while we were working over the recorder, Jean and Bud showed up at Shelby's. So these tapes were recorded there by Jean, Bud, Shelby, Wayne and me, sitting around the dining room table with the recorder in the canter-and assorted children screaming in the next room, There was a lot of wasted tape at the first--testing and all thatso later Wayne recorded three anecdotes he thought of during the conversation after the recording session. WAYNE: You know what the new ground" is? RAIDINE: No. WAYNE: Well, the new ground is a clearing--well, where the farmer goes and cLeans off all the trees and brush- ground that's never been planted before. And this fellow told me a story about new ground-- that everday when he would go up to hoe his corn, that he would have to level out a place in the side a the hill for his dog to lay so it wouldnt roll over and knock down through the cornfield and break all his corn down. WAYNE: Back about three years ago, four years--lm a baseball catcher-- and I was catchin for this team In Spruce Pines, Tennessee, which is a small community. Baseball there is the gama a the day. So this was my first game with this particular pitcher and explain the signals, what pitches we's gonna use that day, uh, I was gonna keep 'em simple. I said, We'll use one finger will be a cur--a fast ball, two be a curve, three be a slider'! And, uh, he told me, says, I don't hardly know what cha mean by a curve er a slider" . I said , "Well, what kinda pitches do you throw?" He says, Well, I throw a fast ball now butand I throw a tater out and a tater in . I bout fell over in my tracks and asked him to explain what it was an he said, Well now, a tater out, it goes in and it, the ball, moves out away from the batter and the tate rin moves in tord the batter. and, uh, what he was explainin was the curve ball and the screw ball. And the reason he called these that was, uh, 'cause they didn 't have money to buy a baseball to practice with so they practiced with, uh, potatoes. IJsuaIIy they-Ive heard one of 'em say the t he would throw tord a hole in the side a the barn to practice his control with a potato. W AYNE : I can remember I was at a game in Mooresburg, Tenn. and my uncle was also a catcher and, uh, back then they didn't have protective cups for the catcher and, uh, a low ball came in one day and hit the plate and, uh, hit him in the crotch so roll in' over on the ground and all the people gathered around, woman and all come out from under the shade trees and gathered 'round him and my grandfather who uz a preacher there, uh, went over to see what was the matter and the crowd was all gathered 'round, a huverint over him and they was a ask in' him, says, Well, what's a matter with Lee? " And he said , says, Oh,, says, just move on back and give him a little bit a air, said, He just got hit in the dolly whacker. This first part of the conversation is hard to under stand as it was recorded before the new batteries were put in the recorder. Jean was talking about her uncle who died of a broken heart at the age of twelve when his ten year old wife died in childbirth. JEAN: --died of a broken heart. WAYNE: Youre kiddin! JEAN : Thats supposed to be the truth, the way they tell it. BUD: Jeans granny was 90 some years old when she died. She said the same thing right on her deathbed. That, that boy died of a broken heart--twelve years old. WAYNE Must be where they get that southern mountain people marryin young. BUD: They did. WAYNE: They didnt marry that young. BUD: They do here in Georgia. A lot of em used to marry when they were ten or twelve years old. SHELBY: (to Jean) Tell about takin' those freckles off your face. JEAN: She's already got it. RADINE: Well, tell it so it'll be on the tape. (Everyone talked at once for awhile so you can't hear any one.) RADINE: Well, tell me the one about takin off warts, Buddy, so itll be on the recorder. Will ya? Again? WAYNE : What was It, Buddy? JEAN : Buddy gets tonguetied when he gets around recorders. WAYNE: What was it? No joke. BUD: Well now--its like is. (clears throat). I'm not a ham. To charm a wart off. A person takes a onion, cuts it in half, the person the t's do in' the charmin' rubs the wart with thar half and buries it, tellin no one where it's at. The person with the wart takes the other half and buries it tellin nobody where its at. When the onion rots, the wart should be gone. RAIDINE : And you said they did that to you when you were ten or eleven? (When he first told this, he said an old woman named McCurry removed his warts by this method when he was a child.) JEAN : They can't hear you shake your head. RADINE: The sound you hear is Buddy shaking his head. (to Jean) Are you going to tell me some now? SHELBY: A cure for a bee sting? I remember that one summer I was stayin' in the country with my---with my aunt and uncle and, uh, I was In a orchard and stepped on some pears that were full of bees and hornets and they stung me and she wrapped my foot in apple butter and tied it with a cloth which I guess the cinnamon in the apple butter is supposed to uh, to uh, cure the bee sting but it didnt feel too good with apple butter oozinbetween yar toes. And another cura for a bee sting is wet tobacco. Unroll a cigarette and put the wet tobacco and put it on a bee sting. WAYNE: That's for snake bite. SHELBY : They also use baking soda. Make a paste out a baking soda for bee stings. And, uh, then another cure, uh, for, uh, a cut or anything Like that is alum. Put alum on it. (Shelby had part of out notes for the first part of this report and was trying to help the others start remembering.) WAYNE: Did you ever hear ever time you kill a poisonous snake youre sposed to hang it up. Did you ever hear that? JEAN and BUD: No. WANYE: We always did that. RADINE: Why? WAYNE: I dont know why. SHELBY: Isn't It supposed to keep snakes away -- poisonous snakes away. What was that one you were tellin about your cow goin dry? WAYNE: You know the king snake is called a milk snake and, uh, if a cow goes dry then they say a milk snake got it cause they thought it miled their cow dry. JEAN: You better see if thats recordin now. It didnt awhile ago. WAYNE: Oh. RADINE : --about your aunt or your grandmother. JEAN: I can't remember any of those she told. BUD : Theyre the ones, they believed in spooks and hants and ghosts. and things. Her dad does too. That's no joking. (Again, I can't understand all of this part. Hes telling about Jean's family moving into a haunted house and back out-and Jean Is denying any knowledge of it at the same time.) --house up there. Your dad and them moved in. They moved back out the same day they moved in, in the middle a the night Said they's a certain time a night, they'd hear chains rattlin around. Start up the stairs, there and a chain dropped right in front a you-on the steps. Day they moved in they moved back out. (more laughter, confusion.) --On____ mountain there. RADINE: Who did you say this was? JEAN : He says it was Daddy. I don't remember. BUD : Your dad told me that and Mammy (her grandmother) backed it up. -down on the bend there-They moved out a lt., they moved up in a mountain. JEAN: No, we lived over in the mountains-- BUD : Mammy said they had everbody there fore they even got away from the place they had 'em load in ' up a movin' back out. SHELBY: Wayne knows one that his grandmother used to tell about a woman comin back from the dead. WAYNE: Yeah. Its wild. RAINE: Is that the one you were telling me about? When was that? WAYNE: Oh, it was back when I was real small. BUD : Old people up in t hare, not necessarily old people, these people that's middleaged, they've lived this stuff all their life. They still believe in premonition afars death, sumpin like that's concerned. SHELBY : Like what? If you see a fallin star thats a sign-----? BUD: No. It's, uh, it's Just feelins they git. They know when, uh, members a their own family--close members of their family--when somethings wrong. They feel that somebodys been hurt in a accident or whether some member a their fam'ly at's lived away had died. A lot a people still believe in that stuff. JEAN: I 'member when my first cousin died they had a picture that had bean hangin' fer twenty years. About one o clock in the mornin that pitcher fell. Woke everbody in the house up and they saidd that it was about on oclock when he got killed. He was workin at Eastman. A truck hit him. You remember that dont ya? It was about twenty years ago, I believe, somethin like at, twentyfive . WAYNE : And that was the time he got killed? BUD: Yeah. JEAN: He worked at Eastman. Got off at eleven. There was a snow on a ground er sumthin. BUD: They said when the picture fell they estimated-- JEAN: It woke everbody up. BUD: --picture fell and at the time a his death, why theys awful close. Coincidence, I guess. People down there, though, you cant convince em a that. They dont believe in coincidence. RADINE: Yeah. SHELBY : You ever hear anybody tell yuh about seein' a ghost or sumpin and believin that theyd really seen it, Buddy? BUD: Yeah. People talk about it. I dont put much faith in it though. SHELBY: About see in' a ghost? JEAN : I told Shelby about that Black Mountain or Brown Mountain Light. What was that? About that? BUD: They never did find out what that was. JEAN : Oh, you know that song. Brown Mountain Light .Brown Mountain Light in North Caroliner. Member Gary Morris went down and watched it when it came out in Kingsport. BUD: Light on the mountain and they been trying to figure out what causes the light. It moves around, they say. JEAN: Old people says its--- BUD: They go to where they see the light and the lights not there. They go over and it's somewhere else. They've even had geologists, scientists try to figure out the cause of it and they never have reached any explanation. It's not a mineral cause or anything. It 's, uh--They never found no reason for it at all. JEAN: The old people tell BUD: The superstition says-- JEAN : that It's a slave look in' for his master that got killed up there or lost er sumpthin and he's lookin with a lantern. BID: -slave carry in' a lantern look int for his master 'at went huntin on that mountain and never did return. They never did find his body, or no trace of him whatsoever. They say the light is passed by the slave roamin' the mountain SHELBY: It looks like a lantern, somebody carryin a lantern? BUD: Yeah, It looks like a lantern. SHELBY: I never heard a that. JEAN: Theres a song-an old hillbilly song BUD: That's only been three or four years ago . JEAN: -back about three or four years ago, er sumpin like that. BUD: -made a record of it. Brown Mountain Light. SHELBY: Wayne, tell about your grandmother talkin about that woman comin back from the dead. That one. WANYE: Oh, it was really nothln'. It's just, uh,-l believe her name was Price. She had, uh, didn't have any pulse er anythin' -Like that and the doctor said, Well, that's all we can do. you know, and thought she was dead. Back before they embalmed people and , uh, they were havin' the funeral and ever 'thing and all of a sudden she reared up in her casket (Everyone laughs) JEAN : I heard that one. It was a humpback and they had a weight on her er sumthin and she raised up right there in the funeral. WAYNE: This is supposed to a happened. My grandma told it for the truth. Said she set up in the casket and everbody like to died. She said, Well, whatre yall doin here? Said, Well, we come to your funeral. She said, Well, Im not dead, she says, but I been to heaven, says, and the people that you think wouldnt be there, are there and the people you think thats bound to be there, are not there. That was it, but---its wild. JEAN : The one I heard. She had a stooped over humpback er sumthin and they-- BUD: strapped her down- JEAN: strapped her down and that strap came loose and she rose up. BUD: Body rised up. WAYNE: Rigor mortis? BUD: Yeah. JEAN : Yeah. BUD: She didn't come back alive. She didnt speak. She just raised up in the casket. (Everyone laughs again) SHELBY : Did you hear about 'em workin on, like, railroads, er sumthin and uncoverin, uh, a family grave. BUD : Well, that's not a unusual thing if a-back years ago, people there they didn't have such things as called cemeteries. Somebody died or got killed er sumthin' they just buried 'em there on the spot. (Later Shelby and Wayne both said Buddy just made that up.) Later if a railroad, er a super highway was gonna come through they're bound to unearth a body or bones or somethin or other. That's happened and-- You got plenty a ice there didn't you, Wayne? (Shelby just gave him an empty glass for his Coke.) SHELBY: No, When I was little, about five, this real old lady, who was about 80 or 90 years old, used to tell about when they were workin ' on the railroad that they came, you know, diggin through this land and uncovered all these, uh, graves and that, -uh, some people they had buried were not dead when they put 'em in there, I member him tellin bout this lady who had, you know, real dark black hair and she had her hands up through her hair, you know, like she was pull in' her hair try in' to get out and some of em had their hands up around their throat gaspin' like gaspin---- BUD: Suffocatin SHELBY: Suffocatin' and he said that It, that it scared all the people that were work in' on the railroad , that a lot of the workers left and it was hard to get anybody to finish it and I think they had to, you know, like move a certain way to keep from goin through the rest of em. that scared me to death cause I was afraid theyd bury me alive. ( Laughs. ) BUD : Well, uh. I don't know. They try to plot around cemeteries-- cemeteries or family plot or what not if at all possible. But even here in Atlanta, they say whenever they put one a these roads around a big cemetery ovar on Memorial where the ground had shifted, they uncovered quite a few bodies or bones that was there. JEAN : Yall aint talkin folklore now. BUD: No, but we're a talkin'l JEAN : Well, pon my honor! SHELBY :Have you ever heard that, well, like a person shivers or has a cold sensation the that theyre sayin, Somebody stepped on my grave. BUD: No. SHELBY: Or, some body walked on my grave. Ive heard that. BUT) : I 've heard say, If old so-andso knew what was goin on now, hed turn over in his grave. SHELBY: Yeah. I 've heard that. But, another one, let's see, its bad luck to step on somebody's grave, if you walk in a cemetery. BUD : Ive heard that. WAYNE : I don't do that. JEAN . Thats respect, Buddy. Thats respect. Id heard that. SHELBY: Youve heard that takin flowers off a gravell bring you bad luck? Cause I used to have an obsession with stealin flowers from the cemetery. ( Laughs ) BUD: I think Backor Brothers did too. (A Kingsport florist who Is supposed to have picked up flowers at the cemetery to be used over again.) (Everyone laughed. ) SHELBY : And I heard that would bring ya bad luck. BUD : 'Bout all the bad luck it brings ya is if ya try to resell em. RADINE: Did you ever remember anymore, Jean, about the wake supper? JEAN: No, I couldn't remember anymore about that. D you ever hear anything about that, about a wake supper? JEAN : Yeah. RADINE : Jean said there was a special way-- JEAN : Yeah. RADINE: Was it a special way you set up the table? JEAN: I don't remember what it was now, but theys supposed to be some thin' come in on a certain night at twelve o' clock. If you're not gonna get married, therell be a casket come in, and if you are theres supposed to be a image of your husband er sumthin. I dont member how it went. RADINE: Do they have wakes there when someone dies? Is it that sort of wake? JEAN: No, its not that kind. I dont know what it was. Its one a them old supersions they did; like the spring-- RADINE: Oh, what was the one about looking in the spring? JEAN : I dont remember that one enither. RADINE: Something about-- JEAN: Spring running a certain way that cha go look in it on a certain day er sumthin and youll see an image a whoever yous gonna marry er sumthin like at. SHELBY : That's kinda like if you sleep on a piece a cake, wedding cake- JEAN : Wedding cake. SHELBY : You hear you'll see your true love. BUD : That's kinda like a kid puttin a pulled tooth under a pillow fer the Good Fairy. JEAN : You read that "Dear Abby" the other day, did you? You read that woman slept with a piece of cake under her pillow for years in Dear Abby"? I read that. She said, "Eat the cake , instead of sleepin on it. She still hadn't got married . She'd been sleepin' on the cake for years. SIIELBV : I can't remember. What was it, Buddy? Kind of an old saying, Its an ill wind that blows nobody good. Is that what you said? Its an ill wind that don't blow two ways. WAYNE: Ill tell you one thing else. If the wind's blow in' out a the East, you wont find anyone thatll go fishin in East Tennessee. RADINE: Why? WAYNE : I don't know . RADINE: It's just not good fishing then? WAYNE: No. Its a sign the fishins no good. JEAN : What's those signs that the fish wont bite, theres some-- I heard em tell, :No se goin. The fish won't bite today" fer some reason. I dont-- WAYNE: The wind's blowin out of the East is what I heard. When it's blowin' out of the East, I dont catch nothin. Ill tell you that! BUD : Nobody else does either. I don't know why. Dont know what its got to do with fish but they just dont bite. SHELBY : You're talkin' about fishin and huntin, and, uh, people there think its bad luck to shoot a dove - cause my dad wont shoot a dove. WAYNE: You won't any a the older people that will. JEAN: Black cat crosses a street in front of you whats supposed to happen? BUD : Bad luck. JEAN: Oh. Bad luck. SHELBY: Walkin under a ladder. JEAN: Whats that one about goin around a tree. BUD: Better say Buttermilk. SHELBY, WAYNE, AND JEAN: Yeah, Buttermilk. Goin around a tree, say buttermilk. BUD : One goes on one side a tree and one goes on other side, person has to say buttermilk or theyll have bad luck. (More confusion while everyone remembers doing this as a kid.) BUD: I dont know where it come from. I just though of it. We used to do it. WAYNE: We did that when I was a kid. JEAN: You throw salt back over your shoulder for somethin that cha do. BUD: If you spill a salt shaker, spill salt on the table, you better throw, take a salt shaker and throw a little salt over your shoulder. Thatll stop the bad luck. SHELBY: What? Do you remember--? JEAN: Break a mirror, you have seven years bad luck. SHELBY: What about a snakefeeder? Whats that a sign of? You know when I was around ponds and lakes-- BUD: Theres sakes around. Theres a snake around. SHELBY: Well, is that a dragon fly? Is that a snakefeeder? WAYNE: No, its a snakefeeder. Its not like a dragon fly. Its a-- Evertime Im fishin, I see em around the-they usually hang around the lake in kind of a stagnant water and you look around long enough, therell be a snake. Where they got their name, I guess. SHELBY: What's that one about cucumbers. WAYNE: Yeah, have you heard that? BUD: What? WAYNE: Myrtle Harrisons the first one that told me about that. JEAN : I heard that. WAYNE: We were out pickin blackberries in this big clump a blackberry bushes there and, oh, just go i n ' to town and, uh, she said, Lord; Get away from there! I said, Why? She said, I smell cucumbers in the that blackberry bush. I said, Well, whats that got to do with it, She said, Theres copperhead in there. Man! liked to scared me to death. From then on, boy, I believe it. SHELBY: Didn't you say your grandmotherd tell you all when you'd ask where you come that one of you come from a blackberrv bush and BUD : Another come out of a cowpile. JEAN: No, one of us was found in a blackberry patch. I think that was Dale. And I was scratched up out of a cowpile by a chicken and Wanda rooted up out of the ground by a pig, or somethin about an old pig out rootin in the ground and rooted up one. WAYNE : They told you that when you were a kid? JEAN: A kid. WAYNE: To keep you from askin questions where you came from. BUD: Backward! WAYNE: Yeah. SHELBY: But, uh-- Everyone wanted to record more so we used the short tape that belonged to the owner of the recorder. JEAN : If you wash clothes between Christmas and New Years- BUD: Christmas and New Years. JEAN : A member a the familyll die before the years out. WAYNE: Is that right? RADINE: You were telling the, the wart cure about the dirty dish rag. WAYNE: That's mine. BUD: I heard that too. RADINE: Her's was different. JEAN: Mine is that you gotta steal a dirty dish rag from some body-- cause i remember my brother stealing a rag WAYNE: Yeah. That's right. You steal it. JEAN: Ya steal It from some body an en bury it. RADINE: Rub it on the the wart? JEAN: Rub it on the wart n en bury it. WAYNE: Bury it under the leak a the house where the water runs off. JEAN: Yeah. When it rots your warts ll go way. BUD: Thats somethin similar to that onion. SHELBY: Didnt you tell about chiggers? How to take off chiggers, Bud? BUD: Just rub fat meat over it. WAYNE: Wasnt there another one, though? SHELBY: I dont know. Have you heard to draw a boil? to draw a boil you take the lining of an egg shell? BUD: Yeah. SHELBY: And put it over a boil and when it dries you pull it off? JEAN : Egg yolk. People use it fer glue and stuff like at. You ever try that? SHELBY: I never heard that. JEAN: We used to do that-- we didnt have any glue. You can use-- BUD: Thats just home-made make-shift git-by stuff. SHELBY: Flour and water. Flour and water is pasta. JEAN: This (the egg yolk) would stick a envelope or somethin like that back together so ya cant tell it. Why I done that lately. (Big laugh from everyone.) Shelby: What did you-- or how did you take off stys? BUD: Ive had that done and I cant remember. JEAN: Go to a crossin in the road and make an X an spit in it er sumpin. (Everyone laughed.) WAYNE: Sty, sty, on my eye-- JEAN: No, if you pee in the road at a crossin, youll have a sty come on your eye--is what causes it. (More laughs.) SHELBY : Oh. Well, you've heard: "Sty, sty, on my eye. Go to the next person that passes by.? Or you say, if somebody says, You have a on your eye. You say, Its a lie. Its a lie. and theyll git it?--and theyll get your sty? BUD : Yeah, I 've heard it. SHELBY: Well, what--what did you do if you had a nose bleed? Did your nose ever--when you-- BUD: Take a piece a brown paper bag and put it behind the upper part a yer lip JEAN: We couldnt afford a dime like you guys. (Big laugh.) BUD: We didnt use a dime--but we always tuk a-- JEAN: When you stop the blood BUD: We tuk a--wed take a piece a brown paper bag. I dont know why newspaper er white paper wont do. JEAN: You hear that one? To stop bleeding, use soot-soot out a a stove-- out a a stove pipe--black soot. BUD: (to children) Yall go on back in there. JEAN:I never knew that. SHELBY: Motherd put a pair a scissors down yer back or a knife, and, uh Let's see now, for earache, Daddy would blow smoke in your ear. Did you over hear about anyone making a hot water bottle out a heatin salt and wrap it in a cloth? JEANl I got a good one for the earache. SHELBY: What? JEAN: What is those bugs--ya call emthat ya break in two- thats great long--? BUD : Got blood in em. JEAN: Got one drop a blood in em. BUD : Yeah. JEAN : Theyre great long. I don't know what they call em. Get back in woods--go up in daid logs and stuff like that . WAYNE: Grub worms? JEAN : No. It's a bug. BUD: It's a bug. Not a cricket. SHELBY : What a ya do with it? JEAN: Ya break it apart and put a drop a blood BUD: -a snappint bug. JEAN: No, it doesn't snap. It's a great old big--God! it's that big! (Indicates her forefinger.) It gits in dead wood and stuff like SHELBY : You pick the bug up and pour the blood in your ear? (Laughs) JEAN : You break It in two. It's jointed-got a joint there and you break that in two and put the drop a drop a blood in yer ear. It's supposed to stop the earache. (Interruption in the recording. Then I asked about her aunt who could blow out fire.) JEAN : I don't remember how it goes now. She had a verse from the Bible that was handed down one in the family to each generation and they could say that Bible verse and blow the far out a ya. BUD : They had to say it to their self. JEAN : They say it to theirself. They don't say it to anybody else. SHELBY: That'd cure burns? BUD and JEAN: It'd blow the fire out a it--out a burn. SHELBY: It cured it? RADINE: It wouldnt hurt you, mean? JEAN: Yeah, it cured it. SHELBY : Won't kerosene take a burn out a a burn. JEAN :I don't know. WAYNE: Well, tell the story. JEAN : That's all of it. Thats it. SHELBY: Do you know any-- RADINE: Whod she pass it on to? JEAN: I don't think she ever did. RADINE: She didn't pass it on to you? JEAN: No. SHELBY: You know a cure for asthma 'cause we had a lot a those from people causa a Kim. JEAN :Nothin' cept the Chihuahua dog. SHELBY : Sleep on a pillow a pine? WAYNE: What's that one about cuttin a clip a their hair, and measurin their height on a sourwood stick, puttin ' the clip a their hair under the bark on the South side, puttin' the stick in the attic, and, uh, by the time she out growed the mark on the stick shes sposed to be over-er sumpin? You ever heard that? SHELBY: What 're those things you're supposed to wear, we were talk int about, around your neck? RADINE: Chamois. SHELBY : Chamois--whatd they wear for now? After we ran out of tape wa stared writing things CURES BOILS: Put hot water in a Coke bottle. put the openin of the bottle over the boil. Also, to draw a boil, use far back. Slice off a think piece and stick it on. Itll stick by itself. HECUPS (hiccups): Take nine swallers a water and hold yer breath. (Jean) Rub the wart with a peach leaf. Throw the leaf over your left shoulder. Walk away and don't look back. (Jean) FRECKLES: On the first day of May, go to a wheat field while dew is still on the wheat. Wash your face-put dew on the freckles-and walk away and don't look back and don't go back to that field until the freckles go away. (Jean tried this when she was a child with many freckles. She jokingly tells people that must be the reason she doesn't have them now.) BELIEFS If you kill a chicken and It has an egg in It and the egg hatches (if you set it under another hen) itll be a frizzly chicken. (Jean) Fall sores (skin Infection on legs at certain time won't heal during dog days. Dew poison causes fall sores. If you go out early in the morning with a scratch on you, poison off the dew causes fall sores. (Jean) A four leaf clover is lucky. If you find a five leaf, pinch one leaf off, make a wish and itll come true. (Jean) If you thank a person who gives you flowers, the flowers will die. It's bad luck to give a knife as a gift. It cuts the friendship. (Wayne ) If you eat green apples, you 'll get the flux. (diarrhea) (Jean's uncle, Little Harry, died of flux when he was eight.) Raw potatoes 'll give you worms. (Shelby and Bud) Playin in dirt gives you pinworms. If a frog pees on you, youll get a wart. Grasshoppers spit tobacco. It's bad luck to cook on Sunday. If a hen crows, it's a bad omen and they kill it to keep the bad thing from happening. ( Jean ) If a son is born after his father dies, he can blow in your mouth and cure thrush. (jean) If cows give bloody milk, theyve been witched. Milk on a half dollar. (Put it in the bottom of the bucket.) ( Jean) Put a piece of rope or hose in a cherry tree so the birds will think it's a snake and stay away. If youre havin your (menstrual) period, you cant go in your cucumber patch. It 'll kill the vines. (During menstrual period) You can't can beans or make kraut-- it'll rot. (Jean's sister believes this and wouldnt let her help one day,) YoulI have your baby on the next full A blister on your tongue is a sign you told a lie. If theres a halo around the moon it's goin to rain tomorrow. (Wayne ) If it rains while the sun shines, itll rain the same time tomorrow. (Jean) If you count the stars as they come out , that's how long you'll live. ( Bud ) When you cut your wisdom teeth, your life is half over. Hoot owl In the daytime is a bad omen. It's bad luck to take a picture of people who are dead. A crawdad won't let go 'til it thunders. Don't eat pork during dog days. PROVERBS Tell a lie and prop it up with another. You can't get blood out of a turnip. You can't take it with you. Misery loves company. Beauty is only skin deep. A person was born fer one thing; thats to die. (Only one sure thing in life. According to Bud this was a favorite saying of Jean's grandmother.) WORDS AND PHRASES Someone who is drunk is high as a Georgia pine, drunk as a skunk, looped to the gills, highern a kite or three sheets in the wind. tightern a drum purty as a pitcher (picture) purty a a red wagon softern a babys hind end eats like a pig crazy as a loon or crazy as a lunatic coldern a well diggers ass cold enough to freeze the balls off a brass monkey highern a chickens back Hes got arms like a mules leg. crooked as a snake or crooked as a dogs hind leg Hes so crooked he could crawl through a barrel a fish hooks and not get scratched. (Bud) busy as a cat on a hot tin roof dark as pitch That went over like a fart in a whirlwind. fit as a fiddle run like a scared haint or run like a scalded dog bled like a stuck hog scarce as hens teeth easier than fallin off a log I feel fine as frog hair. I feel lowern a snakes belly. I feel like Ive been shot at and missed and shit at and hit. shake a leg means get moving not worth a doodly damn pile in an go down in the dumps tit for tat cats got his tongue fit to be tied hot under the collar red as a beet or red as a pickled beet raise hell with a crowbar too pooped to pop when the shit hits the fan Something really obscene is plum tough hearts just a pounin I smell a nigger in the woodpile (If something odd or suspicious happens.) Hes not worth the salt that goes in his bread. (Jean) I whipped him til Hell wouldnt have him. (Wayne) to Halifax and back" (When someone asks where youve been and you dont want to say.) Aint seen you since Shep was a pup. or since Bully was a calf. two shakes of a lambs tall two shakes of a dead lambs tall Thunder is the tater wagon Blood shot eyes look like a Texas road map or two pee holes in the snow. She gripes my ass. or He makes my ass want to chew tobacco. He thinks hes shit on a stick by to me hes shit on a pump handle. (Wayne. About someone who thinks hes great but you dont like) Im so scared you couldnt drive a needle up my ass with a sledge hammer. Going to the bathroom was called goin to hockey. (Jean) Great day! Look at her hockey box! (Bud) I feel like a dog shit in my mouth. (Jean. When you wake up with a bad taste in my mouth.) He couldnt stick his finger in his butt with both hands. (Jean. Illustrates incompetence.) He couldnt hit a bull in the butt with a bass fiddle. (Same as couldnt hit the side of a barn. Wayne.) just like money from home. (easy money) If you aint in bed by 10:00, son, come on home. Greeting: Hows you hammer hangin? Answer: Just the way you left it. Reckon we better git on over tother hill? (Bud, when he was ready to leave.) Things said to and about children: aggravatinest youngn I ever seen" (Shelbys mother said this all the time--about Shelby.) "Whatn tarnation?" "Lord have mercy, young' ns! Lordy mercy Ill box yer ears! Ill slap ya crosseyed. Ill bash ya up a side a yer head. Quit standin there battin yer eyes like a toad in a hailstorm. Whoont ya whup that youngn? (Often asked by Jeans sister.) (A good trick is to ring a switch. Cut a thin ring around the willer switch so itll break when you get wupped.) When a child comes in dirty, hes been rootin with the sow. Hush yo mouth Other words: gangly and gawky I swan pon my honor I do declare shut is shet Sarah is Sary maybe is mybe recipe is receipt arrow is aura pants are paints Shelby has heard autopsy pronounced auto-spy" and physique, fizzy-que. Appalachia is pronounced as "he throw a apple at cha. It 's a great joke there to wonder where Appalachia is and to feel sorry for those poor folks in President Johnsons poverty program. drectly ahnt know up yonder or over yonder nary a one fellers In addition to the story Wayne told about the hill being so steep they had to dig a place in the side for the dog to lay to keep it from breaking down the corn, they tell about planting corn with a shotgun, and about cows with one leg shorter than the other to keep their balance on the hill. Shelby said the night before Halloween was called Corn Night and they would throw corn onto people's porches (especially onto tin roofs) as a warning for Halloween. The next day everyone swept up corn for their chickens. Bud and Wayne didn't remember anything about corn. For Halloween they collected fresh, wet cow manure in paper bags. Then they put a bag on someone's front porch, set it on fire, and watched for the man of the house to come out and stomp on it to put out the fire. These were Flamin Blivets. My nose itches. I smell peaches. Here comes a man With a hole in his britches. Guess what! Chicken snot. Hang it up and Let it rot. What fer? Cat furr, To make a pair a mittens. When you cut your fingernails; Cut em on Monday, cut em for health, Cut em on Tuesday, cut em for wealth, Cut em on Wednesday, cut em for news, Cut em on Thursday for a new pair of shoes, Cut em on Friday, cut em for sorrow, Cut em on Saturday, see your fellow tomorrow, Cut em on Sunday, (better you hadnt been born). (Jean couldnt remember the last line exactly but it was something to the effect that you dont on Sunday.) A PDF transcript exists for this recording. Please contact an archivist for access. Professor John Burrison founded the Atlanta Folklore Archive Project in 1967 at Georgia State University. He trained undergraduates and graduate students enrolled in his folklore curriculum to conduct oral history interviews. Students interviewed men, women, and children of various demographics in Georgia and across the southeast on crafts, storytelling, music, religion, rural life, and traditions. As archivists, we acknowledge our role as stewards of information, which places us inaposition to choose how individuals and organizations are represented and described in our archives. We are not neutral, andbias isreflected in our descriptions, whichmay not convey the racist or offensive aspects of collection materialsaccurately.Archivists make mistakes and might use poor judgment.We often re-use language used by the former owners and creators, which provides context but also includes bias and prejudices of the time it was created.Additionally,our work to use reparative languagewhereLibrary of Congress subject termsareinaccurate and obsolete isongoing. Kenan Research Center welcomes feedback and questions regarding our archival descriptions. If you encounter harmful, offensive, or insensitive terminology or description please let us know by emailingreference@atlantahistorycenter.com. Your comments are essential to our work to create inclusive and thoughtful description.