Carole Reece Apgar and Frances Jones interview with Angus Lorman, Wilburn Vaughn Reece, Madison Price Carnes, and Louis Clifford Rolston

The John Burrison Georgia Folklore Archive recordings contains unedited versions of all interviews. Some material may contain descriptions of violence, offensive language, or negative stereotypes reflecting the culture or language of a particular period or place. There are instances of racist language and description, particularly in regards to African Americans. These items are presented as part of the historical record. This project is a repository for the stories, accounts, and memories of those who chose to share their experiences for educational purposes. The viewpoints expressed in this project do not necessarily represent the viewpoints of the Atlanta History Center or any of its officers, agents, employees, or volunteers. The Atlanta History Center makes no warranty as to the accuracy or completeness of any information contained in the interviews and expressly disclaims any liability therefore. If you believe you are the copyright holder of any of the content published in this collection and do not want it publicly available, please contact the Kenan Research Center at the Atlanta History Center at 404-814-4040 or reference@atlantahistorycenter.com. 0:04: This recording starts with Angus Lorman telling Frances Jones a folk remedy to cure the seven-year itch, an ailment that supposedly occurs seven years into a marriage, using sulfur, lard, and tar. Lorman claims to have never lost a patient during his time as a country doctor and that he was able to diagnose pneumonia, fevers, and cure snake bites using salt and turpentine. 4:12: Lorman tells a story about his daughter, Opel, jumping off a porch onto a nail when she was a child. He then returns to the topic of medicine and shares a cure for acute indigestion using salt and sodie; a cure for earaches using either ashes from a cigarette or warm sorghum syrup; a cure for sore throats using warm salt water; and to keep all diseases away, wear a ball of asphidity soaked in corn whiskey worn around the neck. 9:50: The conversation switches to the topic of planting and weather, specifically planting corn during the full moon. He and Opel talk about the 12 Ruling Days, or the days after Christmas, dictating the weather of each month in the following year. Next, Jones and Lorman discuss bad luck superstitions, such as a groundhog seeing its shadow, as well as ones regarding the fog and thunder. 14:54: Continuing on the topic of superstition, Wilbur Vaughn Reece says he and Lorman told stories about the devil to scare their children into acting obedient. Lorman talks about superstitions related to childbirth and pregnancy. Reece discusses making soap and curing ailments using traditional medicine, such as mutton tallow, apple brandy, and rubbing warts with old bones. Then Reece recalls playing the banjo, fiddle, and jugs. As a child, his community organized square dances and homecomings at Clear Creek Baptist Church. Reece next recounts Thanksgiving and Christmas customs, such as feasts at the church and visits from Santa Claus. His community would welcome new neighbors by firing shotguns and ringing cowbells. He also talks about customs related to shoes and diseases. 28:50: At this point, Reece discusses weather signs, dreams related to death, and how mirrors cause bad luck. He also recalls attending school. He played townball as a child, a form of baseball, and William Matrimitoe, a game that involved stacking fists. He says his father was a seventh son of a seventh son so could cure diseases. At the end of the interview, Reece discusses his strategy for digging a well in the mountains, and how his family used a springhouse, constructed near running water, to keep their food cold. He recalls his familys methods of hog meat preservation. Lastly, he describes his childhood chores, a typical breakfast, the transition of his school from a one-room schoolhouse to a consolidated school, and practical jokes. Angus Lorman (approximately 1888-?) lived in Ellijay, Georgia. He married Ida (approximately 1894-?) in 1933, they each had six children from a previous marriage, as well as one daughter, Opel, togather. Price Carnes (1883-1974) was born to George L. Carnes (1862-1929) and Georgia Mulkey (1865-1893). After his mother died, his father married Martha J. Ray in 1894. Price Carnes lived in Talking Rock, Georgia, with his wife. Wilburn Vaughn Reece (1914-1997) was born in Gilmer County, Georgia, to George Washington Reece and Nettie B. West, the fourth of twelve siblings. In 1942 he enlisted in the United States Army. He was the father of Carole Reece Apgar. Louis Clifford Ralston (1891-1966) was born to William Decatur Ralston (1845-1923) and Naomi Aimee Champion (1852-1918) in Gilmer County, Georgia. He married Millie Minerva Long (1894-1983) in 1910 in Fannin County, Georgia, and they had twelve children: Howard Wayne Ralston (1911-1967), Willie Malone Ralston (1914-1995), Ruby Cordelia Ralston Weaver (1916-1992), Lillie Naomi Ralston Sandidge (1918-1989), Esmer Ruth Ralston Long (1921-2012), Leah Loreita Ralston (1923-1923), Lois Ralston Deems (1924-2017), Joseph Decatur Ralston (1927-1985), Thomas Edwin Ralston (1929-1930), and Viva Elizabeth Ralston (1931-1933). Additional biographical information has not been determined. Frances: Is the seven year itch for when you've been married seven years? Pappy: Been married seven years? Opel: That's where you have it for seven years and scratch for seven years. Reece: How do ya get rid of it? Pappy: You scratch for seven years. Frances: Scratch for seven years? Pappy: Uh Uh. Frances: Right after you get married? Pappy: Well, yea, a whole lot of it goes with that. Frances: No, I don't think I've had that yet. What causes it? Pappy: Ha, ha, ha! You married? Frances: Yes. Pappy: Are you? Franoes: Yes. Opel: Why yes, she's a little mama. You ought to see her baby's picture. Pappy: I declare. Frances: I've got a baby. Pappy: Huh? Opel: Shes a little mama. You ought to see her babys picture. Pappy: Is that right? Frances: Uh huh. (Phone rings. It is someone asking him what to do for their sick child.) Pappy: Why now hear--you have to grease with sulfur, lard, and tar. Frances: That's to cure the seven year itch. Pappy: That will cure the seven year itch. You've got to do that three night--then, uh, uh, wear yar clothes nine days, and now, hear, don't ya git around nobody; they can't stand ya. (Laughter in background) Frances: That's great. Pappy: And, ware ya're clothes nine days and then take a good bath, wash off clean, put ya on some clean clothes, wash ev'rything in the house and then ya'll be well. Frances: I'll have to try that when I get the seven year itch. Pappy: OK. Ha, ha, ha. Frances: Are you called the country doctor around here? Pappy: Not much now--I used ta be, tho'. Frances: You used to be though? Pappy: Yea. Frances: Did you cure everybody? Pappy: Well, now, hear. I'll tell ya this much. No tellin' at the people that I nurs'd with a pneumonie an'I never lost a case in my life. Frances: Is that right? Pappy: I better peck on wood, hadn't I? Frances: You better knock on wood. What did you do for people with pneumonia? Pappy: Well, I give the doctor medicine, of course, and, I-- Frances: The doctor had to have the medicine first, is that right? Pappy: That's right. That right.And, uh, I could sit down at the foot of yar bed and jus watch ya and tell you whether you had pneumonie or not. Frances: How did you know? Pappy: I knowd by yar actions. Frances: What would I do? Pappy: Oh, ya'd just make all kinds of faces and wrinkle them foreheads and . . . Frances: Just make funny faces? Pappy: That's right.Frances: Would I have a fever? Pappy: Sure you would. Plenty of it, too. Frances: And what would you do about the fever? Pappy: Well, I'd roll their sleeves, their gown sleeves to their elbow and I'd take me a pan of warm water and I'd take me, uh, uh, well, I'd call it a rough rag,something like a flour sack. Frances: Uh huh. Pappy: An, I'd bathe that ar..., hand, and arm plum to the shoulders till it git cold right there to them two fingers. Frances: Uh huh. Pappy: Then I would pull that sleeve down and I'd take me a warm towel, and Id dry that off and then I'd pull that off and then I'd pull that sleeve down and I'd put that under the cover and cover it up then I'd do the other one the same way, and if that didn't bring it down, I'd bathe 'em right across the chest hear till you stick them two fingers right down in there beside the collar bone, and When that got cold ya quit right there and I'd bet ya it wouldn't be but just a few minutes till they wouldn't have no temperature. Frances: Is that right? Carole: That is really amazing. Frances: What did you do for snake bites? Pappy: Uh, I nev'r waz snake bit. . . Frances: Did you ever have anybody that was snake bit? Pappy: No, no. Reece: What's the old remedies? Frances: Do you know any old remedies for snake bites? Pappy: Well, salt. . . Frances: On the snake bite? Pappy: Salt an' turp'ntine, either one. They say to wet that in there . . .The best thing to do is to, uh, is to split that place, split the snake bite you, you know? And fill that full of salt an' turp'ntine. They claim it'll draw it out. I don't know. Frances: A mixture of salt and turpentine? Pappy: Uh huh, uh huh. Frances: What about when you step on a nail? What do you do? Pappy: Oh, fill it full of black ink. Frances: And this works? Pappy: And, an, I had one named Opel and then I married Ida and theres her Opel. . . Frances: Oh, I see. Pappy: So, she waz the oldest; we called her big Opel and the oder little Opel. And little Opels jus about as big as two of her. . . (Laughter in background) Pappy: Now, won't them, won't them. . . And, uh, little Opel as we started to say. . . uh, I remodeled my house and I lived down hear at Oakland. And, uh, that was after Opel's mother died. I's in the field one day at work, and they waz a neighbor girl a staying there with her ya know; they's jus' come to visit 'er, an' Opel, she run, jumped off the end of de pouch and jumped on three ten-penny nails sticking up right that-a-way. Ev'ry one of 'em went in 'er heel. Well, they couldn't pull that out. They sent to the field for me and I brought, come to the house, and, uh, I jus' took 'er by the ankel with one hand. and I pulled them out. I was hard to do, but I done, I brought 'em. And I told Hazel, that's my oldest daughter, I said, "Hazel, git me the ink." Black ink's the best, but ya can't git black ink now; it's blue-black. Frances: Blue-black. This is OK too? Pappy: Blue-black. And I just held 'er, and Lawd, she's jus' a-screamin' and a-kickin' to beat the band as for as that goes, but I jus' swum to 'er and. I jus' capped, it was a big mouth bottle, and I jus' capped that right over 'er, Where the nail holes was, you know. They was jus' all right in a wad nearly, that a-way. And, I jus' held her. I jus' soaked that full. Next mornin', that next day, that child wazwalkin' on tha' heel. Carole: No! Frances: I'm going to remember this when my child starts having nails, seriously, cause that could be so painful. Pappy: All right, I'll tell you another remedy. Frances: Uh huh.Pappy: You's hear tell of folks having acute indigestion, ain't you? Carole: Yes Frances: Yes. Pappy: Well, I'll tell you what'll cure that. Frances: What's that? Pappy: That is for a child, give a teaspoon full of salt and a teaspoon full of sodie. But a grown person, give a tablespoon full. Frances: At the same time? Pappy: Jus'-a-put it in a glass and dissolve it up in water an' let 'em. throw it down. It won't be fifteen minutes, it'll be going both ways. (Laughter in background) Frances: I can imagine. Well, what about, have you got any jokes to tell us? Pappy: I cant think of none. Did ya tell em any jokes? Opel: No, I didnt tell em. I left that to you. Frances: I know you can think of a couple, cant you? Pappy: Ha, ha, ha. Well, now I . . . Im full of em all right, but. . . Carole: Come on, give us a couple. Pappy: I cant. Opel: They might need brushing up a little. Pappy: I cant think of none. If I wont. . . Now, here Ill tell him one, ya can tell em that one after awhile. Carole: No, you tell us one. Frances: Wed rather you tell us one. Pappy: Ha, ha, ha. Frances: I jus cant think. Opel, can you sort of renew me up or not? Opel: Well, not right off Pappy, Ill tell ya. . . Pappy: Well, I tell ya, I cant think of none. Frances: What were you cures for earaches? Pappy: Earaches? Frances: Talk in here so we can get it down. Opel: Pappy, tell her, tell her. Pappy: Tell her what ta do fir earache? Opel: Uh huh. Reece: I told her a hot sack of ashes. Pappy: Well, yea, a sack of ashes is all right to put on the ear, but the bes' thin; the bes' thin' ya can do is ta, do you smoke? Frances: No, I don't. My husband does, though. Pappy: Well, he can cure you then. Frances: OK. Pappy: Ha, Ha. Uh, ya jus', course, uh, when I smokes, I ain't smoked a cigarette in eleven years las' Christmas. Frances: Good gracious. Pappy: But, when I smoked, I inhaled it, of course; then jus' cap your mouth down that-a-way and jus' blow that smoke right in your ear. That'll ease it quicker 'an anythin' I've ever tried. Frances: Uh huh. Carole: You ever heard of that? Frances: Is there anything else that will ease it too? Pappy: Well, some people pour syrup in their ears. Reece: Hot syrup, warm syrup. Frances: Hot syrup? Pappy: Warm syrup. Frances: Does it matter if it's maple syrup or what kind of syrup? Reece: Cane, sorghum syrup. Pappy: Homemade syrup. Frances: Oh, yea, Ive had that. Thats good. My granddaddy loves that. Pappy: Yea? Frances: Yea. Do you like that with biscuits and butter? Thats what he loves. Pappy: Well, I can sort of eat it when I aint sick. (Laughter in background) Pappy: Ha, ha, ha. Frances: What about for sore throats, do you have any cures for sore thoats? Pappy: Warm salt water. Frances: Warm . . .thats what my mother uses. . . Carole: Mine, too. Pappy: Uh huh. Frances: Warm salt water. Thats the best thing youve found? Carole: Daddy, whats that about hanging the thing on your bed? Reece: Oh, hes done that. Hang asphidity on your bed. Opel: Oh, God. I wore that around my neck till I waz grown. Pappy: Well, now here, to keep off diseases you just-a fix ya up a little ball of-a asphidity, you know. Tie it up in lit'le rags, tie it around your neck and jus' wear that. Frances: Oh? Carole: That'll keep diseases away? Pappy: That's good. Frances: Any kind of diseases? Pappy: Yea, that's, that's good. But hear, the best way to carry, to do that is put ya a little asphidity in some good corn whiskey. . . Frances: Yea. . . Pappy: And. . . (laughter). . . and, take you a little, take a little stuff along, you know? Frances: Thatll do it, wont it? (LaughteR) Pappy: Thatll keep off diseases. Frances: Yea? a, uh huh. Well, tell us about your farming customs and when you plant your crops. Don't you plant them by the moon or by the stars or something? Pappy: Well, I try to plant corn, a . . .a. . . on a the old of the moon. I don't love to plant it on the new of the moon, it grows too tall. And the ears stick straight up. Frances: Stick straight Up? Pappy: Uh huh. Frances: What about your beans. When do you plant those? Pappy: I plant the be. . ., I plant beans when the signs is in the arms or the feet. Frances: And what does this mean? Pappy: Huh? Frances: I'm not familar with when the signs are in the arms or the feet. Opel: Why do you plan em then? Pappy: Why do you? Well, they, they jus' yield better. If you plan' 'em when the signs is in the boughs, they'll all be specked and rott'n. Frances: uh, huh. What about, do you plant turnip greens? Pappy: I always try to plant turnip greens so to sow the seeds on the tenth of August. Frances: Tenth of August? Pappy: Uh, huh. Carole: Ask him about the twelve days of Christmas, after Christmas. Frances: What about the "12 Ruling Days"? Can you tell us about that? Pappy: I cant. Opel: The days that you keep down, Pappy. . . Pappy: Huh? Opel: The days from Old Christmas to New Christmas or New Christmas to Old Christmas, all that. Frances: The days after Christmas. How does that work? Where you keep track of the twelve days and you. . . Opel: That rules each month. . . Frances That rules each month. . . The weather. . . Opel: Mama keeps. . . Pappy: That rules each month. Thats all I know. I cant tell you. Frances: Is it the day after Christmas: Pappy: Uh huh. Frances: The 26th of December? Pappy: That's right. Frances: And you go for twelve days? Pappy: That's right Frances: Huh. Carole: That is so interesting. Frances: And then, if, if like you have a rainy day this means that month is going to be rainy? Pappy: That's right. Frances: Uh huh. What about if a child looks into the mirror, that the child will have bad luck before it's a year old? Anything like this? Pappy: I've heard it, but don't think there's any, nothing to it. Frances: You don't think there's anything to it? (Laughter) Frances: What about if a child cuts its hair before it's a year old? Pappy: Well, I've heard that waz bad luck. . . Frances: Bad luck? Pappy: But I dont think its anything to it. Frances: Uh, huh. Do you know anything like that that youve heard but you dont believe in, but? Anything like that? Pappy: Well, I dont know. Opel: When do you make your kraute? Pappy: When do you make your kraute? Pappy: Well, I try to make my kraute on the new of the moon. Frances: Uh huh. . . Pappy: Try to pick my beans on the new of the moon. Frances: Uh, huh. What about things like ground hog day. Are you familiar with this and do you believe it? Opel: Yes, he watches for its shadow every year. (Laughter) Frances: Tell me about ground hog day. I for. . . I forget the custom. If the ground hog comes out or something? Pappy: Well, if the hog ground comes out on the 14th of February or second of February, if he comes out and see the shader, they go back and stay 40 days. Frances: And does this mean it'll be cold, or what? Pappy: If they don't see the shader, or if rainy, cloudy day and don't see shader, why it'll be a early spring. Frances: Early spring, that's right. Pappy: And. . . if, if they see the shader and go back and stay 40 days, why it'll be a late spring. Frances: Uh huh. I'd forgotten about that. Opel: There's a snow for every fog. Frances: What about if' you find a fog in the summer, do youknow anything about that? Pappy: For ever' fog that's is in a, a, August, means asnow. . . Frances: In the winter? Pappy: Uh, huh. Carole: What about thunder before 11? Frances: What about thunder or lightning, do you know any,anything about this? Pappy: I don't. Frances: If it thunders before 7, it'll be clear by 11? Pappy: One time I used to uh. . . uh, used to run a store, and uh, I'd go down to Elijay about twice a, three times a week. There's an old gentleman lived on the road and ever' time he'd seen me acoming, he'd git out, thar and hin'er me abou' an hour. One morn 'n I started and it was jus' as smooth, cloudy and the mount'ns was jus', ya couldn't hardly see ' em fer, fer the clouds, it waz so dark. . . Frances: Uh, huh. Pappy: I said, I said, Ratsy, do you believe it gonna rain? Well, he said, Ill tell ya the old Negro sin. And, of course, he waz about-a half himself-- his big hite eyes a-shinning, you know. . . (laughter) And he says, Theres two old niggers one mornn tellin the bes sin of rain theys ever seen. One of em says, Ill tell ya the bes sin Id evr seen waz a smooth, coudy and a-pouring down. The other em says, Ill tell ya jus az good a sin az dat. He says, Whats dat? He says, Tuner fore brekfast. Frances: Thunder before breakfast! (laughter) Pappy: Ha, ha, ha, ha. Frances: Thats good. Pappy: That is a pretty good sin. Frances: Yea, Im going to watch out for it, too. Pappy: Yea, thats a pretty good sin. That waz Rasty Johnson, you remember him. Oepl: I waz thinkin you meant old man Tull. Pappy: No. It was Rasty Johnson. Reece: Yea, I remember him. He looked like he was about ahalf colored Pappy: He was! Frances: Tell me about. . . Mr. Reece was telling us about some tales about ya'll used to tell the children if you wanted to scare them, and make them be good. Do you know of any of these tales that you used to tell your children? Opel: We waz good. Reece: Always taught fem to fear the devil. Pappy: Ha, ha, ha. Frances: hat about the devil? ( Laughter ) Pappy: You just look at me, and I'll jus' look at you. Frances: Yea! ( Laughter ) Frances: You 're a spry boy! Pappy: Ha, hay ha, hae Reece: That man ain't not as old as you think he is now. Let's watch him. Pappy: Ha, ha, ha, ha. Frances: I believe that! ! ! Pappy: I'm not ever goin' get over 16 if I can help it. Frances: Right, right. . .What are you, now? Pappy: Uh, somethin' like that. ( Laughter ) Frances: Tell me about some superstitions connected with child birth and pregnancy. Like, if you were scared by a snake, what will happen? When a wornan's pregnant? Pappy: Well, you know, I ain't ne'er been that way but a time or two. ( laughter ) Frances: You've seen it, though. I know. You had six children. Pappy: Ha, has ha. Well, they tell me if a woman gits soared, they gen tally always they throw their hands up, touch 'emselves somewhar, probably on the. . .uh. . .face and that, uh, uh, child will have, uh birthmark of whatever it is. Frances: Of whatever it is that soared them? Pappy: Uh, huh. Frances: What a-bout if they want a certain food. , perhaps and don't eat it. Have you ever heard. anything about the child when it was born would want that food ? Pappy: Uh, huh. Ask Ida in thar. Frances: I bet she could tell me things like that, couldn't she? Pappy: She was starved ta death for, uh, fruit Frances: Uh, huh. Pappy: And she waz carrin' Lewis. . and that waz awful 'st fruit eater you ever seen. Is that right? Pappy: Uh, huh. Frances: Is 'nt that something. Well, that's what I craved too. I bet little girl wants fruit, too. Pappy: Ha, ha, ha, Frances: That 's what I wanted. Pappy: Yea? Frances: Sure is. What about any old stories. Can you think of any old stories, maybe, that you've heard for just a long time? Pappy: Well. . . I can't think of none. --- Carole: The next interview is with Mr. Wilburn Vaughn Reece who lived in Gilmer County near Elijay for 24 years. Elijay is in extreme north Georgia. First, Mr. Reece, can you explain how you made soap in North Georgia? Reece: Well, we saved all the ashes we burned in the fire place during the winter and put them out in a big old barrel and in the spring of the year when we got ready to make soap we got out there and poured water on those ashes and dripped them down through the ashes and saved all the drippings which was very strong lye and it become thick and it made this soap which was real strong. Thats what we washed those dirty clothes with and it would just take the hide off your hand if you used too much, but it would sure bring that dirt out. Carole: When any of you children were sick up in the mountains did you have any home remedies to help you get well? Reece: Well, if we had a sore throat we always had mutton tallow or even beef tallow. Put about 10 drops of turpentine on this tallow to get it good and hot. Carole: What is tallow? Reece: Tallow is the grease from the beef or grease from a sheep or mutton. Put a little turpentine with that and it was real hard and it would melt down like butter and just swallow that down and it wasnt too hot you would try to gargle a little, but it was good for that sore throat--at least they thought it was--of course children had to take it. Carole: What about apple brandy. Did you ever use that? Reece: Well, apple brandy was a good medicine if you mixed it with a little honey. Thats good for a cough too, loosen up cold, cough it wasnt as bad to take as mutton tallow and turpentine. Carole: You also had an interesting remedy when you had searches. Can you tell us that? Reece: Well, get a hot bag of ashes out of the fireplace, just about as hot as you could stand it and put it right down in the ear and that would heat it up and relieve the pain or else you could blow real hot pipe smoke in the ear. That would relieve it sometimes. Carole: What did you do when you had a wart? Reece: Well, there are several old remedies for that. One of the modern remedies in that day was if you could find an old bone--say anywhere out in the yard, the road or somewhere--you pick that old bone up and you rub it over the wart real good and then you throw the bone behind you just as far as you could throw it never look back and that was suppose to take the wart off. Carole: Did you ever have it happen to you? Reece: Ah--Ive tried it, yes, but I dont know if thats what worked or not. I dont have any now. Carole: When you were in the country what were the musical instruments you used the most? Reece: Banjo and fiddle about the only ones used. Sometimes you had a jug--blow in the jug a little bit and use the banjo when you had square dances along with the fiddle. Carole: Where did you have the square dances? Reece: In homes. Theyd clean out the kitchen, take the table out of the dining room and put it in the kitchen and it would be about big enough for 8 or 10 couples. Youd just shake the house down--just about it. Carole: Was this a popular form of entertainment then? Reece: Well, pretty popular in them days--wasnt too much to entertain you then--sat around and tell jokes and stuff like that, you know. Carole: What did you do during Homecoming or dinner or the ground as you call it? What was this? Reece: Well, this was church. Youre talking about church now. During the summer months there were several churches all over each community and each one of them would have a homecoming during the summer and ah and everyone would bring flowers and decorate the graves--put a bunch of flowers on every grave in the cemetery and that would be in the morning and then at noontime they would get the boxes of lunch out and theyd spread the tablecloths down on the ground and put the lunch all down on the ground and have a big feast and they would have everything in the world to eat nearly. It was real good. Carole: What was the name of the church you were a member of? Reece: Well I wasnt a member. Carole: Well, what church did you go to? Reece: Oh, Clear Creek Baptist Church. I was established about 1840 or something. Carole: How often did the minster come around to preach? Reece: Had church once a month--every first Sunday and usually on Saturday. Had a meeting on Saturday before the first Sunday and had preaching once a month at every church in the community and during the summertime theyd have one week of revival services after people got through working the crop. Carole: How long did an average church service last? Reece: Well, Ive known them to last from 10 oclock in the morning to 4 oclock in the afternoon. Everybody was enjoying the service and we stayed all day. If the preacher didnt hold up to preach theyd end up singing the rest of the day. Carole: Since Thanksgiving is approaching, can you tell us what yall did on Thanksgiving? Reece: Well, we had a service at the church usually and everbody would take a dinner like they had at homecoming in the summer and had a good feast at the church on Thanksgiving day. Carole: Did you have a service? Reece: Had a service. The preacher would always be there and preach a while an then we would have the dinner--everybody enjoy fellowship awhile. Carole: Did you do the same thing at Christmas? Reece: Sometimes, yea, or either meet at the schoolhouse sometimes and have a service at the school house then and have a service the last day before Christmas and have a good time that way. Sometimes have a dinner and everybody in the community got together just like the church service. Carole: Did Santa Claus come and visit all the kids? Reece: Oh--Oh yea, always. We would always go out after he come the next morning and look in the road for the reindeer tracks and all thar and how he got around and how he got down the chimney and try to figure it all out. Carole: When new neighbors came to the community did you have any customs to welcome them? Reece: We most certainly did. We welcomed them with a big--what we call serenade them. We would gather all the cowbells and things we could get off all the cows in the community--get out the old shotguns. We would slip up when we thought they were about ready to go to bed. We would slip up in the yard and somebody would fire the gun and all the others in the crowd would surround the house and all the buckets and bells they could beat on and serenade them for 20 minutes or something and then the leader of the gang would fire a gun to stop and at the at time someone would go up and knock on the door and say we would like to visit with you a little while and naturally he would invite everyone in and build a big fire in the fireplace--sat down and talk awhile. Carole: Did you have a special custom about your shoes? Reece: Oh, youre reminding me now of those cold mornings. Everybody had to get up early and build a fire in the fireplace and his shoes were so frozen up he couldnt get them on his feet--set them in front them in front of the fire, let them thaw out a while, then melt hima little tallow, rub that hot tallow on then and get them a little good and soft and then they was ready to wear all day. Carole: One of the most interesting customs to me is the way you kept diseases off your body. Can you explain to me how you did this? Reece: Well, one old remedy as to put a little of this asphidity they call it, wrap it up in a little bag, tie it around your neck or either hang it on the head of your bed and let it stay there all winter and that was suppose to keep off everything--at least a lot of people did it and though it would. Carole: Elijay is an unusual sounding word. Does it have a special meaning? Reece: Elijay is an old Indian name. It is right in the middle of an old bend up there. Just below Elijay theres two rivers that run together. It was named from the Indians. Thats where the Indians had a camp--started living and hunting in that area. Of course, it is all cleared off and settled now and good land in there. Carole: Could you tell us of some of the weather signs you had? Reece: Well, the weather is a big subject--a lot to talk about. When you seen the sun rising in the morning a lot of red streaks around it, it meant fowl weather coming up and if you seen the red at the setting of the sun that was fair weather ahead. And snow prediction was by the fogs that you had in August--as many foggy mornings you had in August you could explicit that many snowy days in the winter. And if it rained in the morning before 7 oclock, why, it was a good sign it would be ah quit by 11 oclock. Carole: Did dreams have a special significance for you? Reece: Well, therere a lot of old signs and sayings about dreams, but, uh, usually if you dreamed of a wedding there would be a death in the family and if you dreamed of a death there would be a wedding in the family. If you dreamed of a snaked, why, sign there was going to be sickness in the family. If you dreamed of muddy water, why, there, sign of bad luck of some kind ahead--always had to guard against everything. Carole: Was there a special custom about a baby looking in a mirror before it was one year old? Reece: Never let a babe look in a mirror before it was a year old. Carole: Why? Reece: It would be bad luck later on in life. Never cut its fingernails, never cut its hair until it was at least a year old. It was bad luck later in life for a child. Carole: In school what did you do for your lessons. Are they different from what they are now? Reece: Well, its been so long since Ive been to school, I dont know what they do now, but back in our day, why, we started off in the morning about a little arithmetic taking numbers, using the in different ways, trying to keep up with the teacher and how he would arrive at a certain number by calling or we would start off like take four, square it, add 4, divide it by 2, add 2, and multiply it by 2 and you come out with number 24 and it was hard to keep up with a brilliant teacher in them days. Spelling we would have in the afternoon on Fridays. Youd get through with everything early to have a spelling match and wed choose up like we were playing ball and something like that and have two rows of spelling on eon each side of the schoolhouse which was one big room and have two people giving out words and, uh, when you missed a word, why, you fell out or went to the foot of the line and, uh, then you got to a certain point, why, youd, uh, youd set down and the one that stood the longest, why, that was the side that won the match. Carole: What were some of the games you played as a child? Reece: Well, at school nothing but townball mostly. Sometimes we got a little baseball, but it was called townball. Youd choose up and the whole school played, everybody went to bad and thats the way we played the game and, uh, of course, around home in the neighborhood we would play ball called Anty Over. We threw the ball over the house and half of the crowd would get on one side of the house and half on the other and wed throw the ball over and if you caught the ball before it hit the ground, why, you took out around the house and see how many you could peg with the ball and we used old thread balls. We would make thread balls out of--maybe have a little piece of cork or rubber and we would just wrap yarn thread around the cork or rubber and thats the kind of a ball we played with, of course, sometimes youd be in need of a ball so bad youd cut up one of your good woolen socks that your mother had knitted for you during the winter, ravel it out and wrap it around your little piece of rubber and make your ball out of it. Carole: What about William Matrimitoe? Reece: Oh, thats an old game you play in the house on a rainy day when you cant get out. William Matrimitoe, hes a good fisherman, catches hends, puts them in a pen--stuff like that. Its kind of like club fists. Everybody could get in on it. You could stack up your fists one on top of the others thumb and the leader would take his fist and see how fast he could knock them off and if you didnt have a tough fist you gave up pretty quick. Carole: Did you believe anything special about the devil? Reece: Well, devil was always a bad word. Parents always taught you to fear the devil and, uh, if you done anything bad, why, you were always told the devil was going to get you. Always be a good child. Carole: There was something very special about your father. Can you tell us? Reece: My father was a seventh son of a family. He was also the seventh son before there was a daughter was born into the family. Of course, he was suppose to be able to cure certain diseases. Something like a child have what they called the thrash back then and, uh, and if the neighbors had a little child and it had a sore mouth and throat and, uh, everything theyd bring it there to my father and he would blow his breath in this babys mouth and that was suppose to cure it and a lot of times it did or atl east they said it did. Ive known them to come to the field where he was working in the field and he would stop at the end of the field and sat down and take the baby in his lap and blow in his mouth and that was suppose to cure it. Carole: Did you have a special way of finding water in the mountains to dig a well? Reece: Uh, yes. When it was hard to find wed get a forked stick--maple stick--hold each end of it in your hand with the sharp end sticking up and you would walk around the yard anywhere that you wanted to dig a well near where you wanted to dig it and the stick, when you come near a vein of water, would turn down regardless of how tight you were holding it. It would bust the bark off the stick in your hand when you run across a vein of water. I had an uncle once who had a house setting back about 30, 40 feet from the road and he had a well on the back side of the house that always went dry and never had any water in it ever and he wanted to dig another well and he gets this stick and goes around, sees where he can find a better bein of water and he found it near the bank of the road in front of the house. He dug the well just in front of the house near the road and he found a real stream of water and the well never went dry--it always had water in it. Carole: Since you didnt have refrigerators back then, how did you keep your food cold? Reece: Well, we had springs and, uh, we would keep out milk in the springhouse. It would stay pretty cold there and we would keep other foods in the springhouse like sauerkraut, pickled beans, smoked apples--food like that. Some of it would stay all winter long in the springhouse and youd keep butter--keep it from melting--keep it in the springhouse near the water. Let a little water run against it all the time and it would stay in pretty good shape. Carole: Would you describe a springhouse to us? Where was it built and what was its purpose? ReeceL A springhouse is usually built just a few feet below the spring where the water comes out of the ground and the water is cooler there after it has run over the ground a piece. It would be a oblong box 4 feet wide and 10 or 12 feet long or something, 4 to 6 inches deep of water and thats where we sat our milk and the water would run through there all the time. Thats the way we would keep it cool and it served a lot of purposes always cold in there. Carole: Its better than a refrigerator I bet. Reece: Another thing about a springhouse, too, youd set things in there in the winter and that water would never freeze no matter how cold it would get. It never would freeze. Carole: Why? Reece: Water stays nearer the same temperature when it comes out of the ground. Winter and summer and if you wanted something not to freeze just put it in the springhouse near that spring water. It would never freeze. Youd go just below the spirnghouse after the water had run a few feet and it would liable to be iced over the real cold weather. Carole: Another house you had was the smokehouse. How, what was its purpose? Reece: Smokehouse was usually built right out the kitchen door where the women folks could always get to it very quick--kept a lot of food in the smokehouse, meat and, uh, stuff to eat that you had put up during the summer and it was used a lot. Carole: Why did you call it the smokehouse? Reece: Well, thats where they cured the meat--they killed the meat--and they would smoke the meat in this house called smokehouse. They actually had a little fire just enough to make smoke and they cured the meat by smoking it. Carole: Was it a big thing to kill a hog and did everyone participate in it? Reece: Hog killing day was a very big day. We always got up early in the morning, built the fires around the pots of water, heat the water and, uh, have it ready for the big killing and the fun was who was going to kill the hog--shoot the hog or knock it in the head with an axe, whichever way we killed it and Ive shot hogs that would be big and fat, thick skin on its forehead and a little 22 rifle wouldnt even go through his skull and kill him and he wouldnt bat an eye, hed just keep looking at you and youd have to get a bigger rifle and a pistol to shoot it. Sometimes wed take a shot--you put a ball bearing in the shell instead of the fine shot and shoot him with that and, uh, that would kill him. And if sometimes if you didnt want to shoot him youd just take a poke axe and hit them right in the head with the axe and crack their skull a little and down theyd go. When they fell down, why, youd always have to stick them to make them bleed and take a big, long knife--pocket knife first usually-cut the skin and then go way in deep with a butcher knife and the hog would bleed ood and the meat would be pretty and white. And after that wed have a barrel of water sometimes hot water to scald them to get the hair off of them and if sometimes they were too big to go into a barrel we would just lay them flat on the ground and put a big old kroger sack over them and pour water over the top of them like that--hot water--and that would loosen the hair. Get all the hair off then would come the time to hang up, gut them, let hang there until it got good and cold. Along in the afternoon youd cut them up and take them to the smokehouse we were just talking about awhile ago, pack them away in salt and cure them that way. Carole: When did you eat the meat after you killed the hog? Reece: Very soon. Sometimes when we cut them up we would fry a little of the tenderloin--some special piece of it, a little scrap right there and eat it fresh and youd better watch out if you eat too much it would make you sick. Carole: What time did you get up in the mornings and what kind of breakfast did you eat? Reece: Well, we get up very early in the mornings, sometimes anywhere from 4 to 5 oclock and of course breakfast was one of the biggest meals of the day. We got up and sometimes had chicken and dumplings, ham, red eye gravy, biscuits about the size of your fist and it tasted real good before daylight, especially if you had to get out and go to work and had to work all day. Carole: What did you do after breakfast? What chores did you have before you went to school? Reece: Well we had cows to milk, mules to feed, hogs to feed and see that we had plenty of wood got up to burn during the day. . . folks astaying at home. Thats about all there was to do. Walked to school. I walked one mile until I got in the 7th grade. Then I rode a bus. I went 5 miles then to a consolidated school--got high-class when they consolidated them. Carole: How did you like this new consolidated school? Reece: Well, it was so good you didnt know how to act after being used to a one-room school. We even had an indoor basketball court. We played a few games with other schools around. Of course, we didnt have any lighting to start with--had some gas lanterns we hung up all up along the side of the court and we played our first game with those gas lanterns and finally we got a little lighting system they call a delco lighting apparatus and and as long as you could keep the motor running it gave a little better light than those lanterns and we had a lot of fun. Carole: When did you get electricity in the mountains? Reece: Well, about 1940-42, might have been 44 or 45. It was kind of slow getting in there. Its REA system. It sure is handy. Carole: Did yall ever have jokes back then or tales or anything like that? Reece: Well, it was always the custom for one person to pull a joke on another. Well, I had an uncle one time--great big old fat fellow who had rather laugh or pull a joke on you as anything. One night he got it pulled back on him. Along about August when all the corn was in good roasting ears you know and good rainy night and none of the neighbors was going to get even with him, so they went down to his barn, they got all the bells off the cows and went off down in his corn field. They begin to ring those bells. One of them walked up toward the house you know, to wake him up and he heard those bells ranging and he though sure the cows were out in the corn, so up he jump and hollering at the cows to get out and waking up and waking up his wife and his boys to help get his cows out--theyre running his good patch of corn right behind the barn. Well, the people who was ringing the bells down there they heard him slam the door and jump off the porch. When they heard that they kind of hushed up the bells and he run off down there in the field where he though they was ah. They wouldnt make a bit of noise so he thought they was just a-standing real still. So, directly he went back to the house. Well, I cant find them nowhere, so, about the time he got in bed they started shaking them again and here he comes again and he didnt find them that time so, after he got down there that time why, they told him why, were just pulling a joke back on you. You always been apulling something on us. Of course, he says he sure did hate to get out of bed and run down there in his night clothes to get the cows out of the corn when the cows were in the barn laying down asleep with no bell on them. A PDF transcript exists for this recording. Please contact an archivist for access. Professor John Burrison founded the Atlanta Folklore Archive Project in 1967 at Georgia State University. He trained undergraduates and graduate students enrolled in his folklore curriculum to conduct oral history interviews. Students interviewed men, women, and children of various demographics in Georgia and across the southeast on crafts, storytelling, music, religion, rural life, and traditions. As archivists, we acknowledge our role as stewards of information, which places us inaposition to choose how individuals and organizations are represented and described in our archives. We are not neutral, andbias isreflected in our descriptions, whichmay not convey the racist or offensive aspects of collection materialsaccurately.Archivists make mistakes and might use poor judgment.We often re-use language used by the former owners and creators, which provides context but also includes bias and prejudices of the time it was created.Additionally,our work to use reparative languagewhereLibrary of Congress subject termsareinaccurate and obsolete isongoing. Kenan Research Center welcomes feedback and questions regarding our archival descriptions. If you encounter harmful, offensive, or insensitive terminology or description please let us know by emailingreference@atlantahistorycenter.com. Your comments are essential to our work to create inclusive and thoughtful description.